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The Walt Disney Company Discuss Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them? in the Miscellaneous Disney forums; Originally Posted by Hokeyboy And let's not kid ourselves, the HP property is a pretty much untouchable brand (there's nowhere in Disney where people are lining up for over an ...
  1. #16
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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hokeyboy View Post
    And let's not kid ourselves, the HP property is a pretty much untouchable brand (there's nowhere in Disney where people are lining up for over an hour, outside, to go into a STORE!).
    I must say, I was astonished by what we saw when we went last year. We weren't able to buy any merchandise because we couldn't fit into the stores. I feel like it made the lines for the attractions noticeably shorter because so any were in line for the shops, the wait to get into the Owl Post was longer than it took us to get on Peter Pan's Flight.

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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hokeyboy View Post
    And let's not kid ourselves, the HP property is a pretty much untouchable brand (there's nowhere in Disney where people are lining up for over an hour, outside, to go into a STORE!).
    I can tell you've never been to Star Wars weekends. The limited edition store has a HUGE line up. I think we were lined up for well over 90 minutes, and that's for the 30th anniversary of one of the movies. Can't imagine that happening for HP 30 years from now.

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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hokeyboy View Post

    And let's not kid ourselves, the HP property is a pretty much untouchable brand (there's nowhere in Disney where people are lining up for over an hour, outside, to go into a STORE!)..
    I give credit where credit is do too. Universal Trumps with HP. If Disney put HP in any of their parks, Disney Fans would be all over it. Time will tell if Avatar draws nearly what HP has since opening. Or if the new Fantasyland has folks lining up outside the park like HP did for as long as they did. Time will tell.

    Quote Originally Posted by StewbotTalborg View Post
    I must say, I was astonished by what we saw when we went last year. We weren't able to buy any merchandise because we couldn't fit into the stores. I feel like it made the lines for the attractions noticeably shorter because so any were in line for the shops, the wait to get into the Owl Post was longer than it took us to get on Peter Pan's Flight.
    It is amazing the draw of Harry Potter from all age demographics. I can't wait to see if Fantasyland can draw the lines even for their retail shops that HP does. I can't wait to see if Disney can trump HP with Fantasyland.
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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    Quote Originally Posted by HauntedGabe View Post
    Or if the new Fantasyland has folks lining up outside the park like HP did for as long as they did. Time will tell.
    The lines during when HP opened were truly disgusting, and showed everyone that went just how badly Universal planned HP from the start. While visually appealing, it was not made with the guest experience in mind with respect to dealing with the huge numbers they knew were coming. No one should have to go through what guests did those first few months, which is why many who went have sworn never to return to Universal.

    Disney knows better than anyone how to control crowds, and how to give guests the best experience possible. The queueless queue for Dumbo and many new interactive queues show that Disney wants giests to be engaged and entertained, even while waiting for attractions, and not treated like cattle.

    My guess is that the new Fantasyland will bring in larger crowds for sure, but Disney will be proud that you won't see the huge throng of guests in endless lines.

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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    Quote Originally Posted by DVCDad View Post
    Disney knows better than anyone how to control crowds, and how to give guests the best experience possible. The queueless queue for Dumbo and many new interactive queues show that Disney wants giests to be engaged and entertained, even while waiting for attractions, and not treated like cattle.
    I think that sums it up pretty well. By adding something as lame as not one but TWO Dumbo rides, Disney will certainly be controlling crowds. By eliminating them. Hmm. Harry Potter world vs. two Dumbos...
    Really, Walt? Disneyland is MY land? Why would I want a silly little land when I can have the WORLD.


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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    Quote Originally Posted by supernova View Post
    I think that sums it up pretty well. By adding something as lame as not one but TWO Dumbo rides, Disney will certainly be controlling crowds. By eliminating them. Hmm. Harry Potter world vs. two Dumbos...
    Wow, you obviously have no concept of what I actually wrote. Dumbo may be "lame" by your standards, but that's not the point at all. Universal had no care about the guests waiting hours on end, some with special HP packages, only to be turned away from going onto the one new ride touted by Universal as "a theme park within a theme park". Some were shifted from line to line, waiting half the day away just to get into the minuscule HP area, many not being allowed in at all.

    The only line almost as long at Universal were the customer relations lines full of irate customers. For Universal, the endless lines WERE the ultimate goal. But by pissing off so many guests, they took short term gains at the expense of long term losses from the guests vowing never to return.

    No matter what Disney builds, be it a "lame" Dumbo or the best thrill ride out there, they will organize the park and the attraction queue so that their guests don't have to suffer through endless lines and frustration.

    Lame? That's something to call Universal's planning, not Dumbo.

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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    As much as I am not a fan of the books or movies, there is no denying that Universal was able to capitalize on the Harry Potter phenominon. Disney is able to build their company on heritage that they were able to build. Some of their newer non-Pixar projects flopped, so they try to implement these films into the parks, only to remove them very quickly (good luck trying to find Tiana's Jubilee on the Rivers of America any time soon). People are not going to line up in throngs at the gates to ride Dumbo. We both know that. Yes, Universal made their space too small to accommodate the crowds that showed up to see their new area. I wonder how many people went on opening day weren't expecting ridiculous crowds, or were SO disappointed at the response and Universal's lack of crowd control that they weren't excited enough to go back when crowds were lighter? Fact is, Universal was able to one-up Disney on attractions. Two Dumbos and a second kiddie roller coaster isn't going to match it. And I don't see an overflowing parking lot to race in to see Avatar, so that isn't going to match it. What next?
    Really, Walt? Disneyland is MY land? Why would I want a silly little land when I can have the WORLD.


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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    Irate opening weekend crowds for HP are long-since forgotten. No one could honestly say that ticked-off crowds from a year ago are keeping people from visiting Universal IoA in the long-term. I've been there several times since HP-land opened, the last time on a TUESDAY... in early October... and it was still mobbed, even when the rest of the park was relatively empty.

    Anecdotal, I know, but in my observation the appeal of this "land" / property is still absolutely gangbusters. Insanely so. HP plays across all demographics and is internationally ginormous (the international grosses on the movies are usually 3X what they make in the USA... and here they make a ton of dough.)

    Of course, Disney doesn't "need" Harry Potter. They don't "need" Avatar either, IMO. They have enough original content and imagination to build their own magic out of thin air. But at least the competition has forced Disney to up their game.

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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    Thanks for backing up my points. No one went to HP, got turned away because of massive crowds and said, "This place must be awful, I'm never coming back." I would think it to be to the contrary.

    And no, Disney does NOT need HP or Avatar. They have Disney-fied enough Grimms tales and come up with enough of their own stories (plus, the addition of Pixar to help the struggling films division) to look inside for new lands.

    Still, back to the original point of this thread, they are going to need to do SOMETHING to boost their entertainment division. After three straight box office disappointments (Princess & the Frog, Tangled, and Winnie the Pooh), plus the other misc. film projects that all tanked over the past decade or more (anyone remember Enchanted? Home on the Range? Anyone??), they need to stop looking outside and re-examine their own offerings. It used to be that the coming attractions for a Disney film included a preview for their next animated feature, even if it was still a year or two or more out from being released. These days, the trailers are full of everything BUT an upcoming Disney film. I was surprised that they decided to re-examine the old Touchstone division.
    Really, Walt? Disneyland is MY land? Why would I want a silly little land when I can have the WORLD.


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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hokeyboy View Post
    But at least the competition has forced Disney to up their game.
    First, that is the BEST sentence I've read in a long time!!!!

    I give Kudos to the HP attraction. So the biggest fault is the HP attraction is way too popular? Disney would kill to have that problem.
    While Universal was planning for HP Disney was debuting,Stitch's Supersonic Celebration.

    HP continues to draw both in novels, movies and the attraction, all age demographics. I'm not willing to confidently say the new Fantasyland will continue to draw HP type of interest beyond guests initial visit.

    I'm sure the Grand Opening will be crowded, how couldn't it, however, Fantasyland is going to open over several years, HP was opened completed, not mid construction so that will likely tamper the crowd levels for FL.
    Some people are like Slinkies.

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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    Quote Originally Posted by HauntedGabe View Post
    So the biggest fault is the HP attraction is way too popular?
    No, the biggest problem with HP was that is was planned with looks in mind, and not for when crowds show up. Univseral WANTS the huge lines because it sounds good to them. "LOOK AT THE LINES, WE'RE POPULAR!!!"
    It's severely short sighted, as ideally you want people moving through your attractions seemlessly, not standing around waiting. If Disney had the same number of people coming to an area (and I'm not saying the new Fantasyland will do that), they would plan it for the guest experience, and not have you lining up for hours.

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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    Quote Originally Posted by HauntedGabe View Post
    HP continues to draw both in novels, movies and the attraction, all age demographics. I'm not willing to confidently say the new Fantasyland will continue to draw HP type of interest beyond guests initial visit.
    No, that'll be for Avatarland. Wait, no it won't.
    Really, Walt? Disneyland is MY land? Why would I want a silly little land when I can have the WORLD.


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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    Quote Originally Posted by supernova View Post
    No, that'll be for Avatarland. Wait, no it won't.


    Quote Originally Posted by DVCDad View Post
    No, the biggest problem with HP was that is was planned with looks in mind, and not for when crowds show up. Univseral WANTS the huge lines because it sounds good to them. "LOOK AT THE LINES, WE'RE POPULAR!!!"
    It's severely short sighted, as ideally you want people moving through your attractions seemlessly, not standing around waiting. If Disney had the same number of people coming to an area (and I'm not saying the new Fantasyland will do that), they would plan it for the guest experience, and not have you lining up for hours.
    I am having problems pulling your points out here and need clarification before I can respond. Are you faulting HP imagineers for making a good looking, appealing attraction? All parks expand queues when necessary, Disney has and HP has also, is that the problem you have, they now have a longer queue? Disney has over an hour wait and then some on many of the E attractions during regular and high seasons as does Universal parks for their big ones. The volume of guests in stand by for Soar'n, Splash, Space, Test Track, Toy Story are huge, so I can't exactly figure where you are going with your post. Not unusual in regular and high seasons to be an hour to hour and half lines so I am missing your point comparing lines to HP. What is a seamless queue? Current Peter Pan, Thunder Mountain type? Or is standing and waiting, standing and waiting? Explain please.
    Some people are like Slinkies.

    They aren't really good for anything,
    but they still bring a smile to my face when I push them down a flight of stairs.

    Friends are Gods way of apologizing to us for our families.

  14. #29
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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    Quote Originally Posted by HauntedGabe View Post




    I am having problems pulling your points out here and need clarification before I can respond. Are you faulting HP imagineers for making a good looking, appealing attraction? All parks expand queues when necessary, Disney has and HP has also, is that the problem you have, they now have a longer queue? Disney has over an hour wait and then some on many of the E attractions during regular and high seasons as does Universal parks for their big ones. The volume of guests in stand by for Soar'n, Splash, Space, Test Track, Toy Story are huge, so I can't exactly figure where you are going with your post. Not unusual in regular and high seasons to be an hour to hour and half lines so I am missing your point comparing lines to HP. What is a seamless queue? Current Peter Pan, Thunder Mountain type? Or is standing and waiting, standing and waiting? Explain please.
    The HP area of Universal is minuscule, especially the shops. Universal made it for atmospheric sake, and not for the large capacity of people that they knew were coming. Add to the fact that the one new ride is not eligible for their fast pass system and anyone with half a brain could tell that the lines would be atrocious. Universal has done nothing to alleviate the lines. Better planning while the area was still on the drawing board would have made for a much better guest experience.

    While there are long lines at some Disney attractions, Disney are doing their best to lessen the impact. A free fast pass system, interactive queues, and the new queueless queues in the new Fantasyland area shows that Disney thinks of the guest experience, and doesn't want them upset because they were forced to wait in endless boring switchback lines.

    You'll see more and more attractions being renovated with new queue experiences in the near future, Big Thunder mountain being the first. It gives the guests a better experience, lessening their frustrations and increasing the chance of a return visit.

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    Re: Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

    Nope. The best is yet to come for Disney. New technology will allow Disney to retool the parks over the 20 years or so and plus up the experiences. Disney will expand it's media presence just consider how many Disney apps are available on smart phones etc. Pixar will continue to wow the world with ther folms and the Disney studios will get back to form as they re-tool. Look at how good Prep and Landing was. Some work, some vision and Disney will increase the gap between the competition (they are still out fornt, the gap is just closing some). Disney is expanding overseas, the marketing folks will learn a lot form that. Disney is reversing the decline of the parks (investment in DCA, MK). Ups and downs are the way of any business, Disney is already starting to pull out of the decline.
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