Are Disney's Glory Days Behind them?

[StewbotTalborg]

Agree. I never saw Emperors New Groove because of the slapstick feel to it. I'm not quite as bothered by it in Aladdin so much because of Genie's character, he was a powerful, magical being who was cooped up, hyper and a bit of a showoff.

I actually loved Pocahontas, and no, it didn't do nearly as well as The Lion King but then, neither did Beauty and the Beast and I think you will find plenty of people who would argue that film is superior to TLK. I also loved Tarzan, and I believe that film beat out Pocahontas pretty handily as well.

Sheepishly my opinion is that Princess and the Frog was also hindered (in addition to other problems, a lot of people didn't feel like it was a quality effort) a bit by the African-American centric cast. I'd like to believe that wouldn't be the case in our society today but I'm not convinced it didn't play some part in the films performance. Because shamefully, I know a lot of people who are close to me who weren't interested in it at first because of that.

Btw, I just finished watching Brother Bear for the first time and despite it's sub-par soundtrack I really enjoyed it.

[supernova]

Being a fan of the Disney villains, I didn't see Gaston as a strong villain. Actually, I didn't see him as a villain at all. He was a ladies man, but that was it. He wasn't fighting the Beast over Belle's affections for the entire film, he was trying to rescue her. Not a villain. A pompus a$$, but not a villain.

I was listening to a radio show a month or so ago and a comedian was telling a story about a discussion he and another comedian were having about the Wizard of Oz, and who the villain in the story was. His friend was saying that it was not the Wicked Witch... she was just trying to get back something that belonged to her family but was stolen by an out-of-towner. He argued that it was the Wizard who was the villain, because he was using people as pawns to knock off a rival. Now, I have no idea if any of this was covered in those silly Wicked books. I saw the play once, and fell asleep during that dreadful play. Please don't tell me that I'm a guy and I'm not supposed to like Wicked, because my wife fell asleep, too. But anyway, Gaston? Not a villain.

I enjoyed Tarzan, and also felt that Brian Blessed did a great job with Clayton. Plus, he's one of the few villains that Disney doesn't use, and so has not run into the ground (a la Cruella, Malificient, Hook, and Ursula).

I'm right there with you on Princess and the Frog. They realized they were missing a demographic by not having a black princess in their mix yet, so rather than isolate children, they attempted to pull them into the fold. But yes, it was absolutley black for black's sake. You didn't need to be in that pitch meeting to know how that discussion went at Disney:

Pitchman: "I feel it's time that we add an African-American princess."
Exec: "OK. How do you propose we do that?"
Pitchman: "We take an random fairy tale, say, Princess & the Frog. Only we give the frog a crazy pointless accent that is sure to drive audiences out the door."
Exec: "I'm with you so far. Where does this one take place?'
Pitchman: "Right here in the US. Remember Katrina?"
Exec: "I don't think there are any princesses in Louisiana. And, this is the US. There isn't royalty anywhere, period."
Pitchman: "But if it doesn't take place in New Orleans, how can her family run a creol restaurant? And what about this crazy fat crocodile character I created? Look, he has a tiny cute little jazz trumpet!"
Exec: "You're fired."

[StewbotTalborg]

I'm right there with you on Princess and the Frog. They realized they were missing a demographic by not having a black princess in their mix yet, so rather than isolate children, they attempted to pull them into the fold. But yes, it was absolutley black for black's sake. You didn't need to be in that pitch meeting to know how that discussion went at Disney:

Pitchman: "I feel it's time that we add an African-American princess."
Exec: "OK. How do you propose we do that?"
Pitchman: "We take an random fairy tale, say, Princess & the Frog. Only we give the frog a crazy pointless accent that is sure to drive audiences out the door."
Exec: "I'm with you so far. Where does this one take place?'
Pitchman: "Right here in the US. Remember Katrina?"
Exec: "I don't think there are any princesses in Louisiana. And, this is the US. There isn't royalty anywhere, period."
Pitchman: "But if it doesn't take place in New Orleans, how can her family run a creol restaurant? And what about this crazy fat crocodile character I created? Look, he has a tiny cute little jazz trumpet!"
Exec: "You're fired."

That's funny. I don't agree with you 100% on that (maybe 85%), but it's funny.

[HauntedGabe]

Being a fan of the Disney villains, I didn't see Gaston as a strong villain. Actually, I didn't see him as a villain at all. He was a ladies man, but that was it. He wasn't fighting the Beast over Belle's affections for the entire film, he was trying to rescue her. Not a villain. A pompus a$$, but not a villain.

I was listening to a radio show a month or so ago and a comedian was telling a story about a discussion he and another comedian were having about the Wizard of Oz, and who the villain in the story was. His friend was saying that it was not the Wicked Witch... she was just trying to get back something that belonged to her family but was stolen by an out-of-towner. He argued that it was the Wizard who was the villain, because he was using people as pawns to knock off a rival. Now, I have no idea if any of this was covered in those silly Wicked books. I saw the play once, and fell asleep during that dreadful play. Please don't tell me that I'm a guy and I'm not supposed to like Wicked, because my wife fell asleep, too. But anyway, Gaston? Not a villain.

I enjoyed Tarzan, and also felt that Brian Blessed did a great job with Clayton. Plus, he's one of the few villains that Disney doesn't use, and so has not run into the ground (a la Cruella, Malificient, Hook, and Ursula).

I'm right there with you on Princess and the Frog. They realized they were missing a demographic by not having a black princess in their mix yet, so rather than isolate children, they attempted to pull them into the fold. But yes, it was absolutley black for black's sake. You didn't need to be in that pitch meeting to know how that discussion went at Disney:

Pitchman: "I feel it's time that we add an African-American princess."
Exec: "OK. How do you propose we do that?"
Pitchman: "We take an random fairy tale, say, Princess & the Frog. Only we give the frog a crazy pointless accent that is sure to drive audiences out the door."
Exec: "I'm with you so far. Where does this one take place?'
Pitchman: "Right here in the US. Remember Katrina?"
Exec: "I don't think there are any princesses in Louisiana. And, this is the US. There isn't royalty anywhere, period."
Pitchman: "But if it doesn't take place in New Orleans, how can her family run a creol restaurant? And what about this crazy fat crocodile character I created? Look, he has a tiny cute little jazz trumpet!"
Exec: "You're fired."

That is because the fat croc already was a staple at POFC. Disney tried to tie that resort to the movie from the get go. Movie basically flopped and Disney back peddled endorsing FC as the Princess and Frog Resort.

[HauntedGabe]

I'm annoyed with myself that I allowed Disney to trick me with their 3D nonsense for the Lion King. It wasn't a 3D movie to begin with and there was zero reason to have paid the extra money to watch the film with 3D glasses on and not a single 3D sequence to be had. I guess it was just the audience that was "had" over those two weeks. The 3D did nothing for the film. It wasn't created in 3D and so did not need to be shown as such. Oh well. Never again, Disney. Hear me? NEVER AGAIN!!

Thanks for the heads up!

[supernova]

That is because the fat croc already was a staple at POFC. Disney tried to tie that resort to the movie from the get go. Movie basically flopped and Disney back peddled endorsing FC as the Princess and Frog Resort.

All the years of wandering the hotels and I never saw him. The crocodiles I remember was short and thin and more generic-looking than the one in the film. I figured it was more because of the bayous in the area.

[HauntedGabe]

Yep, been there since opening day of Port Orleans, now French Quarter. I swore the crocs were the inspiration for the movie.

[supernova]

I remember the crocodiles, but there were a few in the band. If there is one huge croc with them who plays a trumpet, then I could see them putting him in there. It might have been a good idea to use the name of a restaurant from the hotel in the movie, too. Not sure how much of it was tied in. Still haven't seen the film and (hopefully) never will.

[HauntedGabe]

I'd have to go back and pull my photo albums from when my kids were small to see which instruments. Disney closed their resturant at POFC right after 9/11, which had fantastic foods, Bonfamille's, some of the best meals I've every had on property for an average price. Now all that is left is the food court that is mediocre at best.

FYI, the bigger disgrace is the former Bonfamille's is now sealed into the walls of the lobby/tiny nondescript bar, it is now Disney's Test Kitchen for new entrees. They could have stuck a test kitchen out next to the laundry facility building. What a waste.

[supernova]

I know the marching band crocodiles are still there. I just can't remember any of them looking like the one in the movie.

[supernova]

Saw the Muppet movie and realized that the one thing missing from a Disney film (still have a difficult time grasping a Muppet film as a "Disney" movie, but whatever) were the coming attractions for... Disney films.

It used to be that before Disney movies, you could see previews for upcoming Disney movies. There wasn't a single one before this movie. Just an awful-looking Borrowers movie created by a different studio and promoted by Disney, and what might be the worst Pixar movie to date. And stop with the "But Pixar is Disney" nonsense. They aren't. Disney just played the "if you can't be 'em, join 'em" game. Disney has as much to do with this film as they did back with Toy Story. It's Pixar creating the film behind Disney's marketing and promotion.

[DVCDad]

Saying Pixar is Disney is far from nonsense, it's true, and I got news for you, so are Marvel movies. If you really think that Woody and Buzz aren't Disney characters, you are in the vast minority.

They all reach a different audience, but together there is something for almost everyone. Disney movies are stronger than they have been in decades, if not the strongest ever.

[HauntedGabe]

Saying Pixar is Disney is far from nonsense, it's true, and I got news for you, so are Marvel movies. If you really think that Woody and Buzz aren't Disney characters, you are in the vast minority.

They all reach a different audience, but together there is something for almost everyone. Disney movies are stronger than they have been in decades, if not the strongest ever.

Indeed.

You buy them they are yours. Go back to Snow White loosely translated from a fable as are many of Disney movies from Walt's time. Many would be lost if not re-energized by the Disney family of companies. Marvels is just a more recent acquisition. That is big business. You buy them they are yours. It isn't limited to entertainment, just look at Disney's food suppliers. Stoffers might not have invented Mac & Cheese but they bought the smaller corp and it is now Stoffers. Business Administration 101.

[StewbotTalborg]

I just had the Marvel talk with a friend of mine who isn't a Disney fan. We were watching Thor and I brought up the fact that Disney owned Marvel now and he got all upset about it and pouted about how Disney would ruin Marvel. I ran him though a list of the movies that came out before Disney bought them and after they bought them, including the upcoming Avengers movie. He backtracked on his words a little bit and we came to the agreement that Disney is doing some very good things with the property.

[DVCDad]

I just had the Marvel talk with a friend of mine who isn't a Disney fan. We were watching Thor and I brought up the fact that Disney owned Marvel now and he got all upset about it and pouted about how Disney would ruin Marvel. I ran him though a list of the movies that came out before Disney bought them and after they bought them, including the upcoming Avengers movie. He backtracked on his words a little bit and we came to the agreement that Disney is doing some very good things with the property.

Exactly my point. I'm almost as big a Marvel fan as a Disney one, and all you have to do is look at the latest Marvel movies verses the DC counterparts to see just how well Disney has improved the Marvel brand. The Avengers may be Disney's biggest movie of 2012.