Re: "Paying it forward... with Fastpass"

**MagicMom** · 01-13-2009, 05:59 PM

I may have posted this already, but I guess I was frustrated enough to post again!

We decided on our last day this past November to take the kids over to DHS so they could ride TSMM. We got there before the park opened and made the mad rush like everyone else to get in line. We had very little wait. On the way out of the attraction we got 4 Fastpasses for a return time of about 2 hours later.

I gave them to a family of 4 at the gate, 2 young boys that were prime candidates for the attraction. They took them from me and said, "Oh, ok." and kept walking. No thank you, or wow, how nice. Nothing. I wished I didn't give them to that family because they were rude.

This will not deter me from doing it again, however. It has made me a little more selective in my choice process!

**sterm26** · 02-15-2009, 03:23 AM

During our last visit to DHS, my daughter and I were walking up to the standby line at the Rockin Rollercoaster. We stopped to look at the wait time clock, and then a man ran up to me and jammed two Fastpasses for the ride into my hand, and without saying a word, ran into the fastpass entrance himself and disappeared. Now, this was at the end of an EMH night, so the regular line wasn't too bad, but I still wish that I could have caught up to he man to thank him.

The next night, at Epcot, we held 3 FP's for Test Track. It was also an EMH night, and it was going to be our last big ride on the way out. My wife was exhausted after a long day of walking and decided not to ride, so my daughter and I made the decision to just use the single-rider entrance and ride separately. We gave our FP's to a group of 3 who were looking perplexedly at the wait time, and the genuine thanks we received was all the reward I needed. We got right on (no wait at all for the singles) and the folks who we gave our fastpasses to were right behind us.

**aprilhendrix9** · 03-14-2009, 10:42 AM

We gave our Fastpasses to Rock-N-Roller Coaster to a newlywed couple coming in as we were leaving and they were so excited. They walked right into the park and straight to the ride.

**DONALD2210** · 05-02-2009, 02:47 AM

I love making some ones magical moment. I also love getting a magical moment. On my lat visit I got a fast pass from a random couple and gave out fast passes when I left every park. It was awesome getting it because I had just landed and checked into music then went right off to EPCOT and I walked in the gates and I am passing space ship earth and BAM this couple says do you guys want 2 fast passes.

**dphoto** · 05-11-2009, 09:06 AM

Paul in his post below makes a very valid point. This concept seems to be a system where you make yourself feel good by taking from someone so you can feel good by giving a "gift."

As an extreme example: What if you could take money from someone's pocket and know you would never get caught. But then you don't keep the money, but rather you pick somebody to give the money to. Does that make you a generous person?

Fastpasses don't create more rides per day, they redistribute who gets to ride and when. When you take a fast pass with the intention of giving it to someone else you are doing so at someone elses expense. Either 1) as Paul points out someone else doesn't get a fasspass that day or 2) a number of people had to wait longer so that person that was "gifted" the fastpass could ride.

I'm not saying you are being a horrible person for doing this. But if you really wanted to be "generous" you would give people the fastpass that you were intending on using, otherwise, you are being generous with someone else's fastpass or line wait time.

Sorry for being a glummy guss on my first post on these forums, but I am just pointing out the logic of this concept.

Originally Posted by mritty

Oh man. I'm going to be flogged for this, I know, but.... I really don't like this idea. You're giving a FastPass to someone who is perfectly capable of getting a Fastpass for the same attraction on their own - therefore giving them two FastPasses for the same time period. But in order to do that, you have to take a Fastpass from the central "pool" of fastpasses available, with no intention of using it on your own. There are a limited number of Fastpasses per day. When you take one, you deprive another person from getting one. So you've taken it upon yourself to determine who should get the Fastpasses, whereas it should be whoever gets to the fastpass machine before they're all distributed for the day.

Put it this way. Say there are 100 Fast Passes for Splash Mountain to be distributed today. Those FastPasses "should" go to the first 100 people who get there. That is, there was going to be a person who got the 100th and final fast pass. However, when 75 of them have already been distributed, you take it upon yourself to get the 76th and take it out of the pool. Now, you go ahead with your wonderful gesture and give it to a random family. Then the person who was going to be #100 comes to the Fast Pass machine and sees that they've all been distributed for the day. This person is deprived of a Fast Pass they should have had, and instead the person to whom you've given the 76th got to have two. This does not seem right or fair to me.

Now, if you've gotten a Fast Pass for yourself earlier in the day and then realize you're not able to use it, ABSOLUTELY you should give it to someone before you leave. But you shouldn't be reconfiguring the pool of available fast passes to decide you gets one and who doesn't. That just feels wrong.

Just my 2¢
Paul Lalli

**Stitchgirl1** · 05-11-2009, 09:21 AM

My basic problem with the fast pass system is that you see people getting them when standby is only 10 or 20 minutes, then all the fast passes run out for the day before lunchtime. I think the machines should only become active when the stand by wait time is over 30 minutes.

That said, I think dphoto and mritty should consider that whilst us park regulars and annual passholders know how things work and ensure we get to a ride in order to get a fast pass others may not realise - on a first trip WDW can be overwhelming.

Last summer my husband and I had fast passes for Toy Story, I was feeling unwell and we had to leave the park so we paid them forward. We gave them to a Japanese couple who didn't speak English, didn't understand what they needed to do and were distraught that they wouldn't get on the ride. They were thrilled with the fast passes and we were happy that we had helped them.

In fact I'd suggest that anybody who isn't using their fastpasses, for whatever reason should pass them on.

Respectfully, I acknowledge you are entitled to your opinion about a flawed system but the people we should take issue with are the ones pressing the button on the back of the machine to get multiple fast passes - now that's wrong!

**dphoto** · 05-17-2009, 11:53 AM

I fully agree that the FP system is flawed and I don't have any problem (although Disney may) with someone "gifting" their FP to someone that doesn't understand the system. My point is that it is not really a gift since your "gift" is taking away from someone else.

The system is hugely unfair in favor of those with experience, particularly if you know how far you can push the rules such as the comeback window. If it were me running the show, I would give everyone a limited number of FP per day say, 5 for Day tickets and Passports and 3 for APs (this "bias" is to balance out the experience advantage that AP holders have -- besides they pay less per day). Limiting the number per day would be easily understandable and would keep the FP from running out so soon.

I'm from Texas so I only get to WDW about every 4 years (and Disneyland about every other year and Tokyo DL every other year). So I definitely will use everything that I am allowed to do to maximize the advantages of using FP -- I figure I have to in order to "compete" with regulars. My first rule of FP is collect them early and often, because as it point out, if the comeback time is short, then you can collect more fastpasses faster. With FP in hand, I think go on attractions that have lower capacity and don't have FP.

**Park Hopper Dad** · 05-17-2009, 01:27 PM

Originally Posted by mritty

Oh man. I'm going to be flogged for this, I know, but.... I really don't like this idea. You're giving a FastPass to someone who is perfectly capable of getting a Fastpass for the same attraction on their own - therefore giving them two FastPasses for the same time period. But in order to do that, you have to take a Fastpass from the central "pool" of fastpasses available, with no intention of using it on your own. There are a limited number of Fastpasses per day. When you take one, you deprive another person from getting one. So you've taken it upon yourself to determine who should get the Fastpasses, whereas it should be whoever gets to the fastpass machine before they're all distributed for the day.

Put it this way. Say there are 100 Fast Passes for Splash Mountain to be distributed today. Those FastPasses "should" go to the first 100 people who get there. That is, there was going to be a person who got the 100th and final fast pass. However, when 75 of them have already been distributed, you take it upon yourself to get the 76th and take it out of the pool. Now, you go ahead with your wonderful gesture and give it to a random family. Then the person who was going to be #100 comes to the Fast Pass machine and sees that they've all been distributed for the day. This person is deprived of a Fast Pass they should have had, and instead the person to whom you've given the 76th got to have two. This does not seem right or fair to me.

Now, if you've gotten a Fast Pass for yourself earlier in the day and then realize you're not able to use it, ABSOLUTELY you should give it to someone before you leave. But you shouldn't be reconfiguring the pool of available fast passes to decide you gets one and who doesn't. That just feels wrong.

Just my 2¢
Paul Lalli

I'm sorry for what I am about to say,but this entire post that I have in quote here,makes no sense whatsoever.Especially the second paragraph.You have taken a nice,kind gesture of people being nice to others and turned it into some sort of bad move on everyone's part.maybe there are some that get the fastpasses with the intention of giving them away;but most people,"the majority" does not get them,solely to give them away.
I have never gotten fastpasses with the intention of just giving them away.When we get fastpasses,it is intended to go back at some point of the day,and ride the ride again.We get fastpasses for certain rides,and others we don't.here's an example:we get to the park early,go straight to Space Mtn,get a fastpass,then walk right into the standby line and ride it in the morning hours.Then before the day is over,we go back and ride Space Mtn again.No harm in doing that at all! However,if we choose NOT to ride Space Mtn again,then we would give the fastpasses to another family of four,as ours.That is how we do the "pay it forward",blessing.But I am quite sure that is how most everybody does the "pay it forward" blessing.
So your comment given as you said it,surely does not apply to everyone,but maybe some.Could I say,maybe even you?

**dphoto** · 05-19-2009, 11:53 AM

I'm not saying that people are horrible for doing it and I have done it myself, but calling it "Paying forward with Fastpast" is putting a nice saying to it.

Ok try this logic: you are at the theme park standing in the standby line near the fast pass merge point of the attraction and you see a nice family of 4 walk up to the end of a long line. Do you wave them over and say "Hey, you can cut in front of me". So the people behind you object, so you say "Why are you objecting to me doing a nice thing for these people? It will only make your wait (and all the people behind you) just a little bitle bit longer and it will save these nice people I just met a lot of time." Basically that is what you are doing by giving people a Fastpass, the only difference is that you can easily get away with it.

More logic: Would you object to selling the fast past? Most would say that is clearly wrong. So say you sell it for 10 cents, a trivial sum? So if you give it away, the only issue is the price.

Once again, not a horrible thing and I have done it myself, but it is hardley a gift to take away from one person to "give" to somebody else.

**kat228** · 05-20-2009, 01:01 PM

Originally Posted by dphoto

The system is hugely unfair in favor of those with experience, particularly if you know how far you can push the rules such as the comeback window. If it were me running the show, I would give everyone a limited number of FP per day say, 5 for Day tickets and Passports and 3 for APs (this "bias" is to balance out the experience advantage that AP holders have -- besides they pay less per day). Limiting the number per day would be easily understandable and would keep the FP from running out so soon.

I live in NY. I have an AP. I don't exactly go every weekend. The idea that you have to "compete" with others is absolutely ridiculous. I bought an AP this year because I knew I'd be heading down for 9 days. I thought about a 10 non-expiration pass, but figured that I might get some extra perks by spending the little extra on the AP. I've since added a trip, so I'm getting my money's worth. However...using your logic, should someone who has only paid for a 1 day pass get more Fastpasses per day than someone who has paid for a 5 day pass? After all, the 1 day pass holder is paying a higher per-day average...right?? By "fixing" the Fastpasses, it's still flawed.

I don't get Fastpasses for the purpose of giving them out, but if I have them and I'm not going to use them, I'm certainly going to pass them along.

The idea in this thread is simply to pass along a little magic by giving what you can to other guests. Why ruin that?

**Park Hopper Dad** · 05-20-2009, 06:08 PM

Ok! I've read all of these posts on this thread and I have even posted a few comments along the way.But now,I think this thread has gotten ridiculously out of hand.This thread started out as a nice,friendly thread about doing something nice for someone else,by giving the fast passes to someone if you are NOT going to use them.
But now,it seems like everybody wants to analyze this thread,tear it down and turn it into a guilt trip on those that are innocently doing something nice for someone else.
Why do so many out there,want to turn this innocent act of kindness into a scientific destruction of decentcy?Come on people,let's move on,playtime's over!

**dphoto** · 05-20-2009, 08:18 PM

Park Hopper Dad,

I think you are really over reacting and not reading what is being said. I wasn't trying to tear anyone down. I was trying to point out that there were consequences to this action. The fastpass did not magically create and extra place on the attraction, but rather put the person you gave it to ahead of other people.

Not to get too political, but there is a joke that says "a liberal is someone that is generous with other peoples money." The idea is that they can tax someone to "give" to someone else rather than give their own money. In this case, you are "giving" a cut in line pass to make the person you gave it to wait a lot less so a whole bunch of people have to wait a little longer.

With that fastpass you are not going to use in hand you can
A) Throw it a way or keep it as a souvineer
B) Pick someone at random to give it to -- in this case you are trying to make yourself FEEL good.
C) Find someone that is having a hard time getting around the parks and needs some help and give it to them.

But more of a TRUE gift would be that you have a fastpass in hand for an attraction you wanted to go on, but you run into someone that could really use the fastpass and you give it to them.

**Park Hopper Dad** · 05-20-2009, 09:52 PM

[quote=dphoto;807035]Park Hopper Dad,

I think you are really over reacting and not reading what is being said.

With that fastpass you are not going to use in hand you can
A) Throw it a way or keep it as a souvineer
B) Pick someone at random to give it to -- in this case you are trying to make yourself FEEL good.

First of all,I am not over-reacting,I have read all of these posts,since the first one,and like I said,I have posted comments as well.Also,I am not picking you out personally,about anything you may have said,not at all.My previous post was a generalized statement,about how the posts have gotten out of hand,towards the nice gesture to others.
Lastly,in my response to your letter A),I have kept some fastpasses as souvienirs,because I forgot that I had them in my wallet;had I remembered,I would have been "nice",and given them to someone else.As for letter B),what you have said on your letter B),is exactly what this thread is all about.Giving the fastpasses to a stranger,because you don't want to use them,or because you have chosen to not ride that particular ride again.That is,my friend,"Paying it forward".Being nice to somebody;and we need MORE of that in this world!By the way,one more thing;when I DO give my fastpasses to someone else,it's not because I am trying to make myself "feel good",as you put it,because I don't have a guilty conscience for any reason;I do it because I like to be nice to other people,because as it says in the Bible;"Whatsoever a man sows,that shall he also reap",and I like to reap good things.
Have a magical day!

**captainhook1970** · 06-22-2009, 10:22 PM

This is just so great, no words are needed! We have had people hand us fast passes and I guarantee we will be doing the same on our next trip in Aug! Thx for the great idea

! The magic will be passed...

Gives me goosebumbs just thinking about giving some Mickey Magic...

**Park Hopper Dad** · 06-25-2009, 05:23 PM

Originally Posted by captainhook1970

This is just so great, no words are needed! We have had people hand us fast passes and I guarantee we will be doing the same on our next trip in Aug! Thx for the great idea

! The magic will be passed...

Gives me goosebumbs just thinking about giving some Mickey Magic...

That's right captainHook! Enjoy the fastpasses as they were intended.But if you can't or choose not to,give them to someone else and let them be blessed just like you were blessed.One good turn deserves another.Give and it shall be given unto you(partial quote from the Bible).
Don't be like a lot of these ridiculous posters in here and try to turn an innocent act of kindness into a major fiasco,claiming how wrong or how "unpolitically correct" it is,to do something nice for a stranger.Just between you and me,and all else that reads this,as if I care,some of these people are just plain idiots!And they know who they are.
Thanks Captain Hook for being a decent person and sharing your fastpasses with others when you choose not to use them yourself!
Sometimes,the stuff I read in this forum,just plain gets under my skin,so there!