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WDW Radio # 773 – Top Ten Buildings in Walt Disney World – From the WDW Radio Archives

This week, we explore Walt Disney World from the outside in, as we go back to 2018 and Show 522 to discuss our Top Ten Buildings in Walt Disney World. From the parks to the resorts, we will look beyond the structures and stories, but also at their architectural significance, accuracy, design, and function. We’ll examine the different types of entertainment architecture, the engineering marvels, as well as why they resonate with us on a personal, subjective level.


Step inside the whimsical world of Disney architecture with WDW Radio, your all-access pass to the most magical places on earth. Join host Lou Mongello, along with esteemed guests Tim Foster and Daniel Roberts, for episode #773 of WDW Radio, where we’ll journey through Disney’s imaginative structural wonders in an enthralling discussion that any Disney aficionado or architecture enthusiast won’t want to miss.

In this episode, titled “The Top Ten Buildings of Walt Disney World,” dive deep into the “squash and stretch” artistry of Mickey’s Toontown Fair, explore Spaceship Earth’s emblematic message of hope at EPCOT, and traverse the meticulous Nepalese inspirations in Serka Zong village. Learn how forced perspective and color techniques create the magic we love, all while satisfying your curiosity about iconic attractions like the Tower of Terror and Expedition Everest.

Lou Mongello also opens up about the initial influences behind Tower of Terror’s conception, including nods to cultural icons like Stephen King and the Twilight Zone. Meanwhile, Tim Foster showcases his Celebrations magazine’s significance to Disney fans and teases a new publication to mark its 10th anniversary – “112 Disney Lists.”

We’ll look back at Disney’s architectural storytelling – buildings that are not just structures but narratives set in bricks, mortar, and imagination. Daniel Roberts brings an endearing note of gratitude, reflecting the shared love for the dynamic worlds of Disney.

The episode is peppered with the kind of camaraderie and wisdom that only true Disney experts can bring, complete with impressions and anecdotes that will have you both laughing and contemplating. Moreover, Lou teases a potential episode dedicated solely to the unique use of color in Disney architecture.

Get ready for a magical audio tour that goes beyond the facade to reveal the heart and soul poured into every Disney structure – from Main Street USA’s homespun charm to the sprawling ambiance of the Japan pavilion and beyond. Let Lou Mongello, Tim Foster, and Daniel Roberts guide you through the artistry and enchantment of Disney’s most beloved buildings in episode #773 of WDW Radio.

Don’t forget to tune in, subscribe, and bring a little bit of Disney magic into your daily life with WDW Radio!


  • Toontown Fair’s “squash and stretch” design brings animation principles to life in architecture.
  • Spaceship Earth’s design at Epcot symbolizes hope and represents a feat of engineering.
  • The village of Cirque Zong’s design draws from authentic Nepalese architecture for an immersive experience.
  • Discussion on the storytelling and immersive elements of Expedition Everest’s thematic design.
  • Insights on the Tower of Terror’s conceptual evolution and storytelling approach, with a nod to the Tokyo DisneySea version.
  • Forced perspective techniques in Disney architecture are highlighted for their illusionary effects.
  • Celebrations Magazine’s 10th-anniversary issue and the new book “112 Disney Lists” are introduced.
  • Listeners are invited to share their favorite Disney building and join conversations via Facebook and voicemail.
  • The unique use of color and historical accuracy in Disney architecture is emphasized, with potential for future content.
  • Gratitude is expressed by guests and hosts alike for each other’s contributions and the audience’s engagement.
  • The love for the Japan pavilion’s architectural fidelity is shared, considering a top ten list about Japan.
  • Mention of Memento Mori and Twining’s Tea House exemplifies Disney’s detailed architectural storytelling.
  • Discussion on the cost and engineering comparisons of various iconic structures like Space Mountain and the Tree of Life.
  • The United Kingdom pavilion in Epcot showcases architectural diversity, representing different time periods.
  • Rapunzel’s tower’s architectural and storied significance in Fantasyland is analyzed.
  • Magic Kingdom’s entrance design is praised for its immersive and welcoming atmosphere.
  • The Tower Hotel at Epcot captures historical references and includes distinctive features like echo effects.
  • Michael Eisner’s contributions to Disney’s architectural excellence are commended.
  • Main Street USA’s design is a testament to Disney’s narrative-driven architecture and emotional theming.
  • The Himalayan village of Circa Zong at Expedition Everest stands out for accuracy and theming.
  • Daniel Roberts’ personal top ten building pick is an enigmatic structure in Adventureland’s Jungle Cruise.
  • Architect Michael Graves’ design prowess discussed through the iconic Swan and Dolphin buildings.
  • Michael Eisner’s support of visionary architecture at Disney is heralded as transformative.
  • The episode concludes with reflections on Disney’s “entertainment architecture” and how it assures, stories, and inspires guests.


  • [00:00] Sign up for weekly Disney updates and content.
  • [06:33] Discussion about top ten Walt Disney World buildings.
  • [12:14] Praise for food inclusion; invite for live show.
  • [18:18] Renovated Swan and Dolphin resort, whimsical design.
  • [23:48] Disney’s buildings embrace architecture, storytelling, emotion.
  • [32:57] Connecting shops in Disney increased merchandise profits.
  • [36:36] Tea warehouse turned Yeti museum in Florida.
  • [40:27] Appreciating attention to detail in architectural design.
  • [49:14] Fascinating history and feelings evoked in Toontown.
  • [53:34] Spaceship Earth’s arms provide comfort and assurance.
  • [58:43] Eerie hotel pathway winds through 1930s Hollywood.
  • [01:05:49] Inspiration from various places, love for present tense.
  • [01:12:01] Structures trick eyes, American Adventure building unique.
  • [01:15:01] “The use of color in architecture” – a summary.
  • [01:22:27] Historical and architectural significance of Japanese castle.
  • [01:28:40] Discussion of love for Epcot’s UK building.
  • [01:33:35] Disney creates themed area, including Rapunzel’s tower.
  • [01:38:17] Innovative design of “Tree of Life”.
  • [01:43:56] Architecture and theming in Disney World.
  • [01:50:04] Friend, share your meaningful building thoughts, continue conversation.
  • [01:54:32] Exciting updates as we release new book.

What is your favorite building in Walt Disney World… and why?

Share your thoughts in the WDW Radio Clubhouse at WDWRadio.com/Clubhouse, or call the voicemail at 407-900-9391 (WDW1) and share your story on the show.

Episode Transcript

Click Here To Read The Full Podcast Episode Transcript

Lou Mongello [00:00:08]:
Hello my friend, and welcome to another episode from the WW Radio archives. I am Lou Mangello and this is show number 773. And this. And every week I'm gonna select an Evergreen episode from the archives to share that maybe I haven't heard before, or maybe just one that you haven't heard in a long time. Whether it's an interview, top ten review guide, wayback machines, or more, it's a great way to visit and revisit some of our favorite episodes, including ones that you have suggested from the archives. And this week's episode I chose based on a recent conversation I had with somebody from the WWDO Nation. You can learn more and join and support the show@wwdonation.com. About Architecture in Walt Disney World so I thought that this week we would explore Walt Disney World from the outside in as we go back to 2018 and show number 522 to discuss our top ten buildings in Walt Disney World.

Lou Mongello [00:01:04]:
From the parks to the resorts, we're going to look beyond the physical structures and stories, but also at their architectural significance and their accuracy and design and functionality. We'll examine some of the different types of entertainment architecture, some of the engineering marvels, as well as, I think, why they resonate with us as fans on a personal, subjective level. And of course, I want to know from you what is your favorite building in Walt Disney World and why? I invite you to share your thoughts over in the WWDO clubhouse@wwradio.com. Clubhouse I'll post that question there. Or you can call the voicemail at four oh 7909 three nine one. That's four oh 7900 WW one and you can share your story and your selection on the show. If you're listening on Spotify, I'll post this as a poll question in Spotify as well. And of course, when you're done listening, please go and check out everything I have over at www.radio.com, including a link to our community, blog posts and articles.

Lou Mongello [00:02:06]:
And you can sign up for our free weekly email update and get a free copy of my 102 things to do in Walt Disney World at least once, including 40 free things to see, do, and of course, eat. Plus, you're also going to get weekly updates about Disney news, special content and updates, events, live broadcasts, exclusive content, and much more. Please connect and chat with me over on social. I am at Lou Mangello on Instagram, LinkedIn and Facebook, but for now, sit back relax and enjoy this week's episode from the archives on the WW radio show. I've often spoken about Walt Disney World in terms of the many layers of the onion or cake, depending on your preference and just how deep the storytelling details, history and engineering goes into every project. And hopefully in time, you'll start to not only notice these elements when you visit the parks and resorts and cruise line, et cetera, but also start to seek them out on your own. Because sometimes those details and stories and significance is sort of hiding in plain sight, as we don't see or take specific notice of some of the large examples that are just staring us right in the face. We're sometimes so focused on the minutiae or me the food that we fail to recognize some of the simplest marvels we pass on every visit.

Lou Mongello [00:03:43]:
So this week, I want you to step back with me as we take a bit of a wider view as we explore and discuss our top ten buildings in Walt Disney World. And before we get into exactly what that means, I want to welcome two gentlemen, and I use that term loosely to help navigate this topic. And back once again is Daniel Roberts, who's not just a friend of the show, but continues to be incredibly generous in his support of our dream team project to benefit the Make a Wish foundation of America. Daniel, welcome back, my friend.

Daniel Roberts [00:04:19]:
Thank you, Lou. And Tim, I'm so happy to be back.

Lou Mongello [00:04:23]:
Oh, spoiler alert. Now you just gave away who the other guest was.

Daniel Roberts [00:04:27]:
Oh, sorry. Thank you, Lou Chase.

Lou Mongello [00:04:31]:
Well, look, of course, no top ten or. Well, most. Well, some top tens wouldn't be complete.

Tim Foster [00:04:38]:

Lou Mongello [00:04:39]:
Without Tim Foster from Celebrations magazine. And listen, Tim Foster is like the George Costanza of architecture, so it's doubly fitting that he be here. Tim, welcome back.

Tim Foster [00:04:53]:
Lou, you know I love you, but George Costanza.

Lou Mongello [00:05:01]:
The George Costanza of architecture.

Tim Foster [00:05:03]:
Actually, some people at work have called me that. I don't know.

Lou Mongello [00:05:07]:
I'm an architect anyway.

Tim Foster [00:05:10]:
Well, yeah, but that's not why they called me that. And congratulations, by the way. I think you hit a first. Not only did you totally change the rules for what I'm about, because you ruined everything I had, you got food in and you got a marvel name drop in there, which I don't know if you realized. You did and you did.

Lou Mongello [00:05:32]:
I got a marvel name drop there.

Tim Foster [00:05:35]:
As we marvel at the thing. You dropped marvel into the conversation right out of the gate.

Lou Mongello [00:05:40]:
All right, so wait a minute. How about this? I'm going to double down on that because we're talking about the top ten bill. And it might sound a bit banal to talk about buildings, but here it comes. Like Captain America and Steve Rogers and how the merchant in Aladdin so eloquently put it. Like so many things, it's not what's outside, but what's inside that counts, right? I'm talking about the buildings. Captain America, the street rat. You get what I'm saying there?

Tim Foster [00:06:12]:
Listen, I get. This is a great idea. You take credit for it. I'm thinking 12%. You get 12% credit.

Lou Mongello [00:06:21]:
I like it. I like it. 12%, by the way, appears multiple times in Marvel films. But listen, 15 is negotiable.

Tim Foster [00:06:27]:
It's negotiable.

Lou Mongello [00:06:28]:
But security breach also in Guardians of the Galaxy.

Tim Foster [00:06:31]:
I watched the Avengers last night, so.

Lou Mongello [00:06:33]:
Ha. Well, look, while we're talking about. Yeah, we're not, because we're talking about the buildings of Walt Disney World. And I think when we look at them, there's a lot more than story and structure, but architectural significance and accuracy and impressiveness in design and or function. So I wanted to look at what we defined as our top ten buildings, like, what are they and why they made our list. And as always, we didn't talk about these ahead of time. So I'm very curious to hear where we are all going to go in terms of what made our list and why now. Daniel, you are once again my guest, and I would love to give you the opportunity, the honor, or whatever you want to call it, of going first.

Daniel Roberts [00:07:33]:
I accept the challenge and the curse of going first on the show once again. And I just want to say that thank you guys for amazing top tens, and thank you, Lou. This is my 6th Lou appearance. And for those keeping score at home, the first one was top ten wow moments. Top ten stop. Smell the. Thank you. That eleven, top ten stop.

Daniel Roberts [00:07:59]:
And smell the roses, which Tim thought was a show about flowers, which is fine. Lou and I did a DSi alien encounter. Top ten, sky and the pie wishes for Walt Disney World. Top ten things you think you knew about the contemporary and now top ten buildings of Walt Disney World. And I just want to give Lou credit for the following, that this podcast is the definitive source of information about in the history of the world, the world's most attended and most fascinating vacation resort ever. And for me to be part of more than 1% of these shows is an honor. So I applaud Lou and Tim, don't.

Lou Mongello [00:08:46]:
Say anything else, because you can only screw it up from that. That was very nice, Daniel. Thank you very much. And listen, I love having you on and I love having you back and it's always a lot of fun. So I'm curious to see with your 6th and probably not final appearance, where you want to go with your first top ten building of Walt Disney World.

Daniel Roberts [00:09:09]:
Lads, go with me here.

Lou Mongello [00:09:13]:
Right out of the gate.

Tim Foster [00:09:14]:
Wait, I was told I couldn't do. Go with me here.

Daniel Roberts [00:09:17]:
We are going to the magic kingdom, we are going to Adventureland, and we are going on the jungle cruise. Across from the loading dock on the jungle cruise is an unnamed but very special building. It is a little shack that you see across the river. It has a wraparound porch, it has bamboo poles. The roof is made of thatched straw. It looks like something out of the 1930s that would be in the jungle. There's netting, there's a gun rack, there's chair and a pith helmet. There's all sorts of weird stuff out there and you can't really see indoors, but the structure.

Daniel Roberts [00:10:11]:
When I first went on the ride when I was eleven or twelve, Lou and I are of similar age, although he's older. When I first went there, when I saw that, I said, I want to live in there because I don't know what's inside, but it's the coolest place in the world. I loved the structure. I love the fact that it was not explained. It's not necessarily part of the story, but I made it part of the jungle cruise story. I thought that this is the place where perhaps the person who created the entire jungle cruise lived. Something bad might have happened to him. Maybe he's still out there.

Daniel Roberts [00:10:51]:
Maybe he's battling the elements and the animals. There's a keep out sign. It's almost like the shack itself is almost like a ghost host warning that some bad stuff could happen to you. But if you make it back, there's going to be tea and crumpets in the shack. And I am now going to email him and Lou something. And this goes back to. This is pretty hardcore. I have a little place on an obscure island in the Bahamas called Aluthra and I love this structure so much that I built clubhouse, a bar just like it on my property.

Daniel Roberts [00:11:39]:
And I'm now during the show right now, I am going to email Tim and Lou and they can react in real time to this because I built it. It's not exact, but it's pretty close. And I felt so safe in my imagination, sort of living in this shack that I actually tried to recreate it and I'm sending it right now.

Lou Mongello [00:12:08]:
Okay, so there's a lot to digest here.

Tim Foster [00:12:10]:
First of all, I want tea and crumpets because I didn't know that was part of the job.

Lou Mongello [00:12:14]:
Well, look, I love the fact that you guys all both included food right off the bat. This is very interesting because you went to something that was a little bit more obscure than I thought. However, I loved your very articulate reasoning and rationale and description as to why it should fit in, why it belongs on the list. I'm now looking at the photo of your not so shacky shack in the Bahamas. However, Daniel, I would suggest that in order for us to get the full benefit and flavor of what you're doing there, you should really fly Tim and I down and we should do a live top ten from the Robert Shack in the Bahamas.

Tim Foster [00:12:58]:
Wait, I'm looking at. I just got the email.

Daniel Roberts [00:13:03]:
Hold on. Yes, you guys would love it. You are invited anytime. I'm now going to have a picture also of the inside of the shack.

Tim Foster [00:13:14]:
Wait, promise me this though. You bring us down for Christmas and you jingle cruise it up.

Daniel Roberts [00:13:22]:
But anyway, I think that aside from the fact that that structure and you guys know that structure when you leave the dock, right?

Tim Foster [00:13:34]:
Sure. I've never seen this building.

Daniel Roberts [00:13:36]:
I don't know.

Lou Mongello [00:13:38]:
You're an idiot.

Tim Foster [00:13:39]:
Jungle. Where's the jungle?

Daniel Roberts [00:13:42]:
But I found it. It's one of the few things that's not really ever spoken about by your guide. And it's never really referred to. It's just there and it's something that you have to seek out. And again, when I first saw it as a kid, I was just so into it. And every time I saw it, I was like, wow. I just sort of occupied my mind. I just wanted to know the story behind who lived in there.

Daniel Roberts [00:14:07]:
And I think that's important with structure. If the structure is so provocative a that you're craving, you build a building like it or you keep on wondering about what the story could be, what's inside that.

Lou Mongello [00:14:24]:
Know we hear me. Disney enthusiasts who decorate their rooms, they decorate their office, they decorate themselves, they decorate. I have never seen anybody actually recreate a Walt Disney world other than Michael Jackson recreate a structure in their bahamian backyard. So I applaud you and if you give me permission, I will post that photo in the show notes.

Daniel Roberts [00:14:48]:
Please do. And beat it. Wait a second. That was a Michael Jackson.

Lou Mongello [00:14:53]:
I got you.

Tim Foster [00:14:54]:

Lou Mongello [00:14:55]:
So Tim, I challenge you to beat not.

Tim Foster [00:15:00]:
I'm not even going to try. Let's see. Well, I went a weird way on this top ten.

Lou Mongello [00:15:11]:
You can't go any weirder than that.

Tim Foster [00:15:17]:
When you said, go with me there.

Daniel Roberts [00:15:22]:

Tim Foster [00:15:23]:
Yeah, no, I like it where I'm going to do. Mine were more general, I guess you'll see as I go through here. I didn't want to bog down with this. I'm going to blow lose and daniels right out of the water here. I didn't want to go down the path of this building. And world showcase was inspired by the 13th century fortress of the thing, Philippi, the Mayans and the thing and the Phoenicians, and been in the Alphabet. And it's because, like history, because you'll all just as you are right now, as I lulled you to sleep. So mine are more general.

Tim Foster [00:15:59]:
But the first place I'm going to go, this might be surprising, because I don't know if most people, when you think architecture and magnificent buildings at Walt Disney World go to this place, but I'm going to go to the Epcot resorts and of all of them, and they're all beautiful. I'm going to the swan and I love you, man.

Lou Mongello [00:16:17]:
Oh, that a boy.

Tim Foster [00:16:19]:
Oh, wow. Okay. For a couple of reasons. First of all, to pay homage to the great Michael Graves, who, wonderful, magnificently artistic architect, and, of course, did the architecture for the swan and dolphin. Also did, and I always find this fascinating to tell people, did the design for Disney's corporate headquarters in Burbank, which the coolest part, and this is neat, because nobody. This is a building you don't see. This is not out in the parks or anything, but for those who don't know and didn't see it, of the many fabulous features of that building, perhaps the most striking is the. I think it's the entrance of the building, where there are columns and there are six of them, and they are six of the seven dwarfs that are actually the columns.

Tim Foster [00:17:17]:
And the second floor comprises one column, that being dopey, the most famous and best and most beloved of all, the dwarfs. But that building is so cool in of itself. If you ever a chance to not visit it, but even just google it, look at some pictures of it. There's lots of books. You're going to hear me rustling here, probably because I have a million books in front of me, but there's so many cool things about it, from the outside to the interiors to the offices and so forth. But that leads me to swan and dolphin, which Michael Graves also designed. And I'm sure we've talked about the swan and dolphin a lot in past shows, talking about the statues themselves. 56ft tall, 60,000 pounds the swans and the dolphins, the mahi mahi versions of the dolphins and not those dolphins, which I admit that confused me the first time I was there, but I get it now.

Tim Foster [00:18:18]:
But the thing with the swan and dolphin right now, the reason I bring it up, I was actually just did a story about it in this little magazine we'll talk about later. But Michael Graves'interior design had his lot to do with the whimsy and the nautical whimsy. Think of another word of the resort. And there was a lot of backstory and a lot of theming that went into it. Now, recently, the swan and dolphin went, underwent a major renovation. If anyone who's been there in last year or so knows that they redid the lobby and most of the decorations and all of the guest rooms and so forth. But the one thing I want to point out, if you haven't seen it yet, I saw it for the first time at Christmas when I was down there in the dolphin lobby. And the dolphin lobby had historically been home to this beautiful, gargantuan white poinsettia Christmas tree, which was fabulous, rivaled only by the jaw dropping Christmas trees at wilderness Lodge and Animal kingdom and so forth.

Tim Foster [00:19:28]:
But this year, Christmas, the poinsetti tree was gone. And in its place was this magnificent chandelier. It's not even fair to call it a chandelier. This is a work of art. It was hundreds and hundreds of crystal globes hanging from the ceiling. And I thought that took the place of the Christmas tree. That was a Christmas decoration. But lo, to my surprise, that is now the centerpiece of the dolphin lobby.

Tim Foster [00:19:56]:
And if you haven't seen it yet, I strongly urge you to go check it out. The lobby itself got a total design makeover as well. But the chandelier is amazing. If you look underneath it is the four dolphin fountain. And if you go underneath it and look up, it's just an incredible slight. It's like a million kaleidoscopes glistening in front of your eyeballs. Again, that's not to take away from all the other architectural details of the swan and dolphin. The fountains, as I said, the clamshell fountain that is out front of the swan keep getting my buildings mixed up, but the whole complex is so beautiful and well designed that it's well worth the visit just to see it.

Tim Foster [00:20:52]:
And very different from the yacht club, beach club, boardwalk, seaside theme that the rest of the Eccott resorts have. It's very much a unique structure in itself. And like I said, it's got a wonderful new addition I really encourage you. Go check it out, because my jaw just dropped when I saw it for the first time.

Lou Mongello [00:21:10]:
So I'm really happy that you actually not just included this, but more importantly, that you led off with this, because I think, sorry. These buildings are significant in Disney for a number of different reasons. And this really goes back to Michael Eisner, because when he came on back in 1984, he very much was, and continues to be very enthusiastic and fascinated with architecture and very much was a patron of architects and realized the importance of bringing somebody in, like a Jersey guy, like Michael Graves, who had actually never designed a hotel before in his life. And Ike Eisner really fought very hard for him. And when the buildings were first built, there was a lot of criticism. Obviously, they're not officially Disney hotels, but they thought the design was very confusing. It was a bit garish, it was a bit plain. But Eisner, when he dedicated it, was very much supportive of the design and said that he actually felt that they erred on the side of the fantastic.

Lou Mongello [00:22:38]:
And the only way to avoid the criticism is to build a bland box, which he didn't want to do. It was all about creating impact and liberating, sort of from the general context. And what those buildings did was start a wave of, I don't want to call it an architectural renaissance, but a beginning of a trend of look. Look at things like Team Disney, which is an administrative building on property near Disney Springs. It's another example of a functional building that is still stunning yet graceful, and it's a little bit whimsical. This was actually from a japanese architect, Arada Isozaki, whose first work in the US was the Museum of contemporary art in LA. But like the swan and dolphin, it was about setting a theme, not, know, Mickey Mouse or castle or things like that. It's sort of the idea in this building, like, of time, right? There's a whole building, sort of.

Lou Mongello [00:23:48]:
And if you've ever been inside, you'll see there's a tower in the center that's not just ornamental from the outside, but inside is a sundial, which I still believe is the world's largest, that functions as a place for cast members to go, but also to observe the passage of time. So these buildings that may have received criticism or may just seem like office buildings or convention centers actually embrace a lot of what I think we're going to talk about. What I actually plan on talking about in terms of architecture, in terms of entertainment, in terms of story, in terms of engineering marvels. When I approached this I didn't look at this topic as these are just my favorite buildings because I like them, because I like the way they look. I thought about some of the inspiration behind the creation of these structures, right? So it's that architecture of reassurance, that feeling that we have inside Disney that we know where we are and we feel safe and we feel secure. It's the architecture of storytelling, how it sets a stage and how it sets a place. More importantly, the architecture of emotion, because I think maybe story could even be secondary or tertiary to the emotion that these places should elicit from us, right? Because we love this place, because of how it makes us feel. And I think some of these buildings are meant to be inspiring, right? So, like the chinese theater, it gives us that romanticized sense of history and the past or Morocco, the way it's designed for us to wander and explore and sort of slow down and stop and smell the roses.

Lou Mongello [00:25:43]:
And that is a very wordy, long winded way to get to where I'm going first. Don't say I'm setting no.

Tim Foster [00:25:53]:
Every word. And thanks for knocking off two of my next items.

Lou Mongello [00:25:56]:
I didn't. But I'm sort of explaining.

Tim Foster [00:25:58]:
Yes, you did.

Lou Mongello [00:25:59]:
I didn't mean to wait.

Tim Foster [00:26:01]:
I have a question for you before you start.

Lou Mongello [00:26:02]:

Tim Foster [00:26:03]:
I don't mean to interrupt you. No, Michael, great. I meant to find this out. I know when Michael Eisner came in, and in retrospect, I mean, there's your opinions of what he did and did, right and wrong and all that kind of stuff. But I know when he came in, one of the things that he did focus on was the architecture. And there was a term for what his approach was, and it escaped me, and I'm desperately trying to look it up. Do you know what I'm talking about? A term for what his attitude towards in terms of architecture within Disney and what he was trying to do.

Daniel Roberts [00:26:45]:
I think it was called capitalism.

Tim Foster [00:26:50]:
I think it really was architecture, like form over function.

Lou Mongello [00:26:55]:
I think the idea, and maybe this is. I think it was what they termed as entertainment architecture.

Tim Foster [00:27:01]:
Yes, that's it. That's the term I was trying to think of. And I couldn't find. But, yeah. And I just wanted to say, because for whatever we think of Michael Eisner and things he did know, whatever, him bringing that to Disney at that time is one of his stamps of good things that he did do. And Swan and Dolphin is just one example of it. But I did want to give credit where credit was due, and I was really trying to figure out what that term was. And thank you.

Lou Mongello [00:27:32]:
Yeah. And if you've listened to, I did a show, gosh, I think it was episode like 426, I think was the. The. We talked about the Disney decade in our wayback machine look. I applaud Michael Eisner for a lot of things, and the shift in attention to detail in terms of the design, architecture was very much rooted in him. Look, even when building the swan and dolphin, he came in, or was brought in five, six, seven times to review plans and to review progress because he wanted to make sure it was going to align with what he wanted for his vision of the park. So he wasn't just looking at the design, but he was looking at textures and paint colors and light fixtures, because it goes back to the eisnerism that everything speaks. And I think he even said it costs the same amount of money to build a 1400 room ugly building as it does to build something that can speak and be beautiful and tell a story.

Lou Mongello [00:28:47]:
And I think the swan and dolphin are perfect examples of that.

Tim Foster [00:28:51]:
Yeah. And even today, with a lot of changes that have happened over the years there, but it's still. I love it there, and I'm still.

Lou Mongello [00:28:59]:
Waiting for you to actually.

Tim Foster [00:29:02]:
You did.

Lou Mongello [00:29:04]:
I won't even get into the new lobby bar, fins or blue zoo or anything like that. I'm not going to talk about that because I actually did.

Tim Foster [00:29:12]:
That's fine. So you got it in there.

Lou Mongello [00:29:15]:
So as long as I was in my introduction, I will try and limit my first one on my list. Although you're going to accuse me of cheating, but it's not. It may be a stretch, but it's not a cheat because the first one on my list, in terms of buildings that are significant and impressive and beautiful and tick all the boxes of what I just talked about in terms of the architecture of emotion and storytelling and reassurance and the past is Main street USA. And for all intents and purposes, they.

Tim Foster [00:29:50]:
Are technically, Daniel's out.

Lou Mongello [00:29:54]:
Well, we. But look, I knew there was going to be overlap. I want this to be a conversation. This is a conversation, not a presentation. Right. But technically, Main Street USA is just two buildings. Right. And if you've listened shameless, plug to my audio tours of Main Street USA, you'll know that this remarkable architecture and the story that's being told spans a century of growth and development.

Lou Mongello [00:30:21]:
And I talk about how while this victorian era town was similar to me, it has a much more New England influence and it's an idealistic view of what Main street should be. But it's a warm, inviting place. It's very free from contradictions. Unlike Disneyland, which is obviously inspired, sort of, by small town Marceline, this is a little bit more affluent, eastern seaboard culture. A little bit more opulent, a little bit more symmetrical in some of the designs. The storefronts seem to be a little bit more connected, which I think leads to that idea of this very close town sort of growing over time. And every part of it, to the eisnerism, speaks from the color choices being very bright and welcoming and based on ones that were used in the early 20th century America, to the textures and the patterns, makes main street sentimental and evocative and colorful, and builds on that ideal. And everything does speak, from the props to the lattice work, to how they used forced perspective in it.

Lou Mongello [00:31:48]:
And I think it is a very inspiring, evocative, emotional place. And for me, Main Street USA remains one of my favorite places anywhere in Walt Disney world. And I think it's because specifically of the design of the buildings know sort of wrap their arms around us as we walk through.

Tim Foster [00:32:14]:
Indeed, this is tough. And there's three, because I don't know who's jumping.

Daniel Roberts [00:32:19]:
Actually, Lou, I want to ask you a follow up question.

Tim Foster [00:32:22]:

Lou Mongello [00:32:24]:
What do you mean, get them?

Daniel Roberts [00:32:27]:
Stop it. Do you miss the shops on Main street being segmented?

Lou Mongello [00:32:33]:
You just want me to talk about the house of magic so I can tell a story about my dad and cry again.

Tim Foster [00:32:41]:
That was so rude. I'm so sorry.

Daniel Roberts [00:32:45]:
I know. But do you? Because you seem to be happy that there's just two structures. But I sort of missed when the different shops were segmented.

Lou Mongello [00:32:57]:
So there is the nostalgic part of me that missed sort of going in and out of each of the stores and the house of magic. And not that I ever went into the tobacco shop, but the card shop and the candle shop being their own individual spaces and places and stories. However, from a design, from a logistics, from a guest experience point of view, not only did it make sense to connect them all for a variety of reasons, but from a. Listen, let's call it what it is from a retail marketing standpoint, when they connected the interiors of all of those shops and changed the way they approached the entrances, where now you didn't have to sort of bounce in and out and check out ten different times. You went into the emporium and you stayed inside, and there was visual weenies that brought you from one section to the next to the next. Profits in merchandise went up exponentially. That's not a secret. So much so that other companies like Nordstrom's and Macy's and other big box retailers were coming to Disney to figure out what they were doing in terms of design in order to make that happen.

Lou Mongello [00:34:22]:
And it does. It makes sense and it works. You'll walk in by Casey's corner. Next thing you know, you've got a basket full of stuff and you're ending out over by the car.

Daniel Roberts [00:34:34]:
You have. You have, like, five hot dogs, four dresses. No, you're right, though. It's brilliant. All right, is it my turn?

Tim Foster [00:34:45]:
It is your turn. And I'm buckled in and I am prepared to go with you here.

Daniel Roberts [00:34:52]:
We are going to Nepal. My first. We are going to the himalayan village of Circa Zong.

Lou Mongello [00:35:03]:
Welcome to the Himalayas.

Daniel Roberts [00:35:05]:
Exactly. We are going to the prelude to expedition Everest, which in my opinion, in recent times is the most impressive structure in terms of theming, in terms of planning, in terms of sentiment, in terms of historical accuracy, and in terms of labors of love in the history not only of Walt Disney world, but of any theme park ever. Now, yes, this is even kingdom.

Tim Foster [00:35:43]:
Great adventure. You're not giving a nod to that.

Daniel Roberts [00:35:45]:
Even that.

Tim Foster [00:35:47]:
Wow. Mighty.

Daniel Roberts [00:35:50]:
Yes. Now this is. It's okay. I'm used to the. I'm the third wheel. I'm used to.

Tim Foster [00:35:56]:
I'm just going to shut up. I'm sorry.

Daniel Roberts [00:35:59]:
I love you, Timmy. Doesn't matter. This is Joe Rody and Stefan Hellwig, who went away for a while, and when they got out, just kidding, they went away to Nepal and they bought everything you see there. And they researched everything you see is. Let's. Is there are four or five buildings. There's something called Norbu and Bob's himalayan escape booking office. There's Tashi's general store and bar.

Daniel Roberts [00:36:36]:
There's a tea warehouse that's been turned into a Yeti museum. There are homes, there's a monastery. It apparently that someone who had lived there saw what they had done, who was an onsite designer, and started crying, like, literally just crying because of the accuracy that she felt like she was home. In the pagoda, the monastery, there are 1000 carvings of the yeti. And, I mean, all these things were done there, brought over to central Florida and then recreated. Everything there has meaning, especially the museum itself, of any prelude to any ride. And I know this is not a top ten about the queue, but as a structure, and there are a variety of them, but if you look at them all as sort of one entity, it is the most compelling village. And apparently they chose so many accurate different, because there are many different religious sects that they chose all these different renderings of what the yeti means to different people.

Daniel Roberts [00:37:52]:
And you can see it because some look like fairy tales and some look like baby stories, some look ferocious, some look like cautionary tales, and all these different influences, and then the weathered prayer flags. I mean, holy cow. This is one of the most impressive set building pieces in the history of the world as a structure, and that you get the soul of the place. And it's an amazing irony at Disney for this. The ride is a ride. You know what's going to happen. The yeti's not going to dance. You're going to have fun.

Daniel Roberts [00:38:29]:
You're going to get back and continue on your way. But the feeling in the queue in these buildings, in this village, the feeling is that this stuff mattered to people.

Tim Foster [00:38:42]:

Daniel Roberts [00:38:45]:
This transcends imagineering. There's a factual element, there's an archaeological element to this that grants credence to the whole ride. This, to me, is one of the most impressive put togethers anywhere. And now it's not four walls and a roof and a door structure, because it's open aired, as are structures that are in NEpaL and in the HiMaLAyas, beneath the HiMaLAyas. But this makes you feel, even though you know your outcome on the ride, which can be fun and safe, that this makes you feel as if something perhaps mystical or magical might happen. And that is all because of the structure, these buildings, and the stuff inside.

Lou Mongello [00:39:36]:
So I agree with you a thousand percent for a wide variety of reasons, and I won't go into an exorbitant amount of detail. I actually don't think I've ever done a DSI Disney scene investigation of expedition Everest. More importantly, this village of Cirque Zong, which. Do you know what Cirque Zong means, anyone?

Daniel Roberts [00:39:57]:
It means stop googling Betty White.

Lou Mongello [00:40:00]:
No, it means fortress of the chasm.

Tim Foster [00:40:03]:
Do you know where you can find that out, Lou?

Daniel Roberts [00:40:06]:

Lou Mongello [00:40:06]:
WWE radio. Because I just said it.

Tim Foster [00:40:08]:
Do you know where else you can find it, Lou?

Lou Mongello [00:40:10]:
In the archives of WW Celebrations magazine.

Tim Foster [00:40:14]:
I'll tell you later.

Lou Mongello [00:40:15]:
Oh, boy. Anyway, thank.

Daniel Roberts [00:40:21]:
So when I was speaking, was googling the village of Circus, what I wanted to say.

Lou Mongello [00:40:27]:
Killing me small. You're killing me tonight. The reason why I like this entry, and I appreciate your comments and sentiments about the importance of it and the details, is not just because of the artifacts they brought over and the building materials that they use and the construction methods that they used to make sure this building was going to be accurate, because they knew that not at some point, someone from that area was going to come and say, this looks exactly like a place that I visited. It looks exactly like a place that I grew up. But I love how, in my eyes, this building, this village, doesn't necessarily begin in the village of Circuzong, but it begins as you start on your trek through Anandapur to the base of the mountain. And it really is leading up to. It's almost sort of a preview of the story that you're going to get once you enter that first building in Cirquezong. So I absolutely agree.

Lou Mongello [00:41:36]:
This belongs on the list, and I promise that I will do a much deeper dive into the building and to the details that are in.

Daniel Roberts [00:41:45]:
Thank you.

Tim Foster [00:41:45]:
Thanks, Lou.

Daniel Roberts [00:41:49]:
By the way.

Tim Foster [00:41:50]:
Oh, wait. Is it my turn?

Daniel Roberts [00:41:51]:
Wait a second. I'm sorry. I have one last.

Tim Foster [00:41:52]:
I'm not done.

Daniel Roberts [00:41:54]:
All right. Do you know that all Sherpas are named Sherpa?

Tim Foster [00:42:00]:

Daniel Roberts [00:42:01]:
Yes. Their last name is Sherpa. For real.

Lou Mongello [00:42:05]:
What's your name? Bill Sherpa. Joe Sherpa. Exactly.

Daniel Roberts [00:42:08]:
But you better be good at climbing, Mr. Sherpa.

Lou Mongello [00:42:11]:
Little Timmy Sherpa. All right, Timmy Sherpa, go ahead.

Tim Foster [00:42:15]:
No. All right. First off, I got enough nicknames right now. I don't need that one.

Lou Mongello [00:42:21]:
Little Timmy Sherpa is not going away anytime soon.

Tim Foster [00:42:27]:
Just stop. I will applaud. Unlike Lou, who ripped you unmercifully, I will applaud Daniel's last one. That was fantastic. And I will say, even though you all know I've actually been on expedition Everest. Surprise. I've been on it once. But no, I agree.

Tim Foster [00:42:51]:
Theming in attractions like pretty much any new attraction from the architecture, everything is phenomenal. I might just go on expedition Everest, and I'm sure there's a chicken exit right before you get on. But just to experience the pre show, the buildings, because that's an attraction in.

Lou Mongello [00:43:11]:
Itself, like flight of passage. I think that you need to go through the full queue of expedition Everest at least once.

Tim Foster [00:43:18]:
We're kind of straying off topic. That's one of the fast pass. Well, it's not actually a list thing, but the merits of the fast pass line versus the standby line, and it's the trade off of the time you save versus the. A lot of times you miss that full experience, Peter Pan haunted mansion. But that's a show for another day. Today we're talking about architecture, so let's literally. This is a go with me here on a whole different level. This is not a go with me here.

Tim Foster [00:43:57]:
In location. It's not a go with me here in what weirdness is little Tim and foster going to talk about now? This is go with me here as we travel through time. Because I am taking us back to interesting. Long gone now. We can't see it in Florida anyway. But Mickey's Toontown fair was very interesting architecturally in that it was the one place in Disney where you could see this sort of architecture, which very much inspired by the animated movies that, in turn, inspired land itself, which. The purpose of which was to bring to life the world of animation in a world that we could walk through and. And touch and feel and experience.

Tim Foster [00:45:03]:
And it was. It was done through the use of what they call squash and stretch architecture. In which case meaning that instead of just square, rigid shapes and rectangular windows and perfectly level door frames, here things are, as the name implies, they're stretched, they're squashed, they're squished, they're curved. Part of the idea, one to convey the whimsicalness of the animation of the films, but also to kind of give the illusion that everything was in motion. Everything was kind of moving, just like in a cartoon. So it was fun to go through and see all the various buildings, whether it's Mickey's house or Minnie's house or Donald's boat or what have you. And to see how quirky everything was. Not just on the outside, but on the inside.

Tim Foster [00:45:58]:
Even down to the furniture and the bedding and Minnie Mouse's kitchen. And I'm sure a lot of people out there just like me. Have 1012, 1516 pictures of your young child standing at Minnie's refrigerator, tracing their height as they grew. And could they reach the first shelf, then the second shelf, then the third shelf with the cheese and all that? But I was interested in doing the show. And believe it or not, actually, I did do homework for this, Lou. You might be surprised. I did homework. But now I was reading about how they developed this and came to all the little nuances that went in.

Tim Foster [00:46:48]:
I get to name drop another one of my favorite Disney people of all time, Mary Blair. In that she didn't have anything to do with the design of Mickey's Toontown fair per se. But the people who were involved in designing it were inspired by her. Not her designs, necessarily, but her idea of that. The designs and the buildings and windows and doors and everything you see didn't have to be just the straight laced ones. We all know about. There's a place you could be free with shape and color and form and everything else. So that did serve as an inspiration for leading them down the path of architecture of two town fair.

Tim Foster [00:47:32]:
Another thing I came across which I found really interesting was that having almost been an architect in high school, until I realized I wanted to be an architect because I like drawing the building. So I switched to art, and the rest is history. But the architectures involved and the engineers involved. Traditionally, you would have your blueprint plan with all your mentions and drawings and so forth, and you'd bring that to the site. And the people building the buildings would understand what that meant, and they would proceed accordingly as they built the structure. But because this was so offbeat, since this was so unlike anything he had done before and so unusual, they couldn't bring a 2d plan to the construction site and say, have at it, gentlemen. They're like, what is this? I don't even know what this is. They actually had to make actual 3d models, tiny ones, and plexiglass cases to bring them in.

Tim Foster [00:48:25]:
And that's what the construction team and the engineers had to refer to when they were building this, because there was no precedence for building a roof that was curved and crooked and looked like it was falling off. So that was pretty interesting. Dare I say, not the last example of many architectural engineering innovations or different ways of doing that Disney has come up with over the years. But as we know, Toontown Fair is no longer with us giving way to new fantasy, which I have a feeling is going to pop up later in this conversation. But before we got to that, I just wanted to give a nod out to the whimsy and the fun and the color and the just cartoony that was Tootown fair.

Lou Mongello [00:49:14]:
Well, I appreciate that interesting entry, which I like it because, look, Toontown fair as it was, really was almost a happy accident. We know how this really began from what was supposed to be a 6812 month temporary land known as Mickey's birthday land back in June 1988, when they were celebrating Mickey Mouse's birthday. And eventually it became Mickey's Starland, Mickey's Toontown, if you would like. And admittedly, in my eyes, a very fascinating look at the history of it. You can still get my Mickey's Toontown fair audio CD for just $10. But I digress, because I think it was interesting how that space went from flat facades and simple circus tents to a land that used that Frank and Ollie squash and stretch principle of animation and brought it into three dimensions, which, again, I think goes back to some of those principles and that architecture of reassurance and a place that not just adults, but kids really felt safe and secure and short. People like me felt like it was built, like, at our scale. So again, it's about why and how that place made us feel.

Tim Foster [00:50:42]:
Exactly. Lou, I know they built the first story windows in main street. Lower, so the kids could look in. I just mentioned that because.

Lou Mongello [00:50:54]:
No, because you've got. Listen, you might as well share the knowledge that you have, so show off when you can. It's not often you do research, so I'm happy. Listen, you have.

Tim Foster [00:51:03]:
I'm happy I did that. Oh, by the way, since you shameless plug once in a while, that audio CD you mentioned, I heard that's got a really killer cover on.

Lou Mongello [00:51:12]:
It does really nice art by a former architect named. I've heard it on the street. I am not going to go with a. Go with me here. I'm going to go with something that I think is. I almost left it off because it's blatantly obvious, but the reason why I put it on my list is possibly not for what you think. It's not on because it's iconic and an icon. It's not there because of the way it looks.

Lou Mongello [00:51:46]:
It's here because I think it is one of the shining, literally, examples of true engineering masterpieces and creativity, but also in a way that you might not necessarily realize. And the building that I'm talking about is spaceship Earth. We're all in this together. It's okay. Again, look, you know, about it being a geodesic dome and the platforms and the dual spheres I've talked about on the show, I think it's a wonder of Walt Disney World. We've done a know DSi dive with all of the numbers and the panels and the triangles and the height and.

Tim Foster [00:52:32]:
All of tankus dodecahedron.

Lou Mongello [00:52:35]:
Right. But, yes. Good job on the.

Tim Foster [00:52:41]:
Is that my math teacher?

Lou Mongello [00:52:42]:
Good job on bing. But while I think that this is appropriately an icon of Epcot, because of how innovative it was in its design, construction and function, it also embraces what Epcot was supposed to mean and what I think it still does. And Epcot was the theme of Epcot wasn't necessarily just about the future, but it wasn't just about the technology of the future, but it was about a future of hope. Right. And we think about that in terms of. Oh, well, the hope for the future in terms of technological marvels and nations coming together. And I think spaceship Earth fits into that as well. And you might not realize, and I want you to actually go next time.

Lou Mongello [00:53:34]:
And this is going to sound like a Tim Foster. Go with me here until what I'm going to say is going to be validated by somebody who, hopefully, you represent the next time you look at Spaceship Earth and you look at those gigantic angled arms that are sunk 180 or so feet into the ground, they're there for support and they're there for the structure, but they really are meant to make you feel that those are arms kind of reaching outward towards you from the globe, almost in terms of an embrace. And if you don't believe me, an imagineer by the name of John Hench, you may have heard the name said specifically, and I quote, the columns of spaceship Earth are constructed to reach out like beckoning arms. It's designed to say, you're okay. You're going to be okay. So those columns that almost look just very mechanical and functional are meant to be inspiring. They're meant to be somewhat optimistic and comforting, which are some of the things I talked about before, in terms of that architecture of assurance, reassurance and architecture of emotion. So while it is an engineering masterpiece in terms of the design and the way it's created and the functionality of it, I think what it really does, and I think part of the reason why we don't necessarily recognize it, is the icon of Epcot center, is because of what it's meant to represent.

Lou Mongello [00:55:10]:
It's not a cold, static building. It is sort of meant, like I said, with main street USA, to sort of wrap its arms around you and welcome you in, not just to the park, but into the future. That it.

Tim Foster [00:55:25]:
It. I don't buy.

Lou Mongello [00:55:29]:
So you're saying John hench is wrong?

Tim Foster [00:55:32]:
Yeah. Okay.

Lou Mongello [00:55:35]:
Where can they contact you? It's Timmy Foster. What is it?

Tim Foster [00:55:38]:
Yeah, it's t. Foster at celebration. Now that is such a wonderful. I never thought about it that way, but darn you, because I know when you walk. You're talking about when you're walking up through the entrance, through the front.

Lou Mongello [00:55:54]:

Tim Foster [00:55:54]:
Right. Yeah. I always had a vague, warm, fuzzy feeling when I did. Now I know one.

Lou Mongello [00:56:04]:
I'm going to start singing in the arms of angel just to sort of.

Tim Foster [00:56:08]:
For real. That is really cool when you say it. I totally see it now. I never thought of it that way. See, this is a cool thing when you can go. Thanks to you. Thanks to you, Lumunchell, and you, Daniel, because I'm space here. But thanks to you guys, this show, and like Eddie's show, we're going to see things.

Tim Foster [00:56:30]:
Listeners are going to see things in a totally different way. I never saw spaceship Earth like that. I'm going to see it that way the next time I go. And I'm going to go, holy cow. And I'm going to look across the jungle cruise thing, even though I'm scared to death and I can barely.

Lou Mongello [00:56:45]:
That's just because you want Daniel to take you to the.

Daniel Roberts [00:56:51]:
I. I just spoke to my engineer and architect, and we're going to build a little magic shop behind the jungle cruise bar in Luther.

Tim Foster [00:57:00]:
Can you build a pentangus Dodika headdron?

Daniel Roberts [00:57:03]:
No, I don't have enough acreage, but maybe a very miniature one. Guys, is it.

Lou Mongello [00:57:11]:
It is. Please go.

Daniel Roberts [00:57:13]:
Okay. Gentlemen.

Tim Foster [00:57:16]:
Yes. No.

Daniel Roberts [00:57:18]:
Yes. I'm bringing you back to the 1930s. I am bringing you back to California. I am bringing you to the tower hotel.

Lou Mongello [00:57:28]:
I wanted you to start singing going back to cali, Cali, cali. But go ahead.

Daniel Roberts [00:57:33]:

Lou Mongello [00:57:34]:
Take me to the twilight zone, tower of terror.

Daniel Roberts [00:57:37]:
I will now the building itself. I'm not going to go into all the architectural detail. I will say that it is spanish colonial revival. And the reason that's important is because it has that sort of reddish color. And I'm going to start with the architecture and then get to the fun stuff before seen before. Little Timmy Sherpa falls asleep. Sorry, Timmy.

Tim Foster [00:58:08]:

Daniel Roberts [00:58:09]:
Sorry. But it is visible from Epcot, so the back of it resembles the exact color. It blends into the skyline of the Morocco pavilion. And if you think about those colors, they are identical, my friends, of the tower in Morocco and the Tower Hotel.

Tim Foster [00:58:39]:
Anyway, literally, I'm speechless.

Daniel Roberts [00:58:43]:
Me, too. But that's how they did it, because you can see the back of the hotel, so they wanted to blend in so it doesn't look out of place from the purview of Epcot, so it sort of looks like part of the scene. Next, I'm going to tell you about the wonderfully creepy and beautiful way that you wind your way up to the hotel, that you pass things that would have been at an actual hotel in the 1930s in glamorous, beautiful Hollywood. Pathway is cracked and curved. It goes over all these overgrown gardens and signs, and there's signs actually pointing to stables, a bowling green, tennis courts, swimming pools, a pavilion. And then you hear, in my opinion, one of the best sound effects. And I know this is perhaps from a different show, but I love of any musical effect in Walt Disney world. I love the echo effect of the 30s jazz that plays because it doesn't sound live.

Daniel Roberts [00:59:58]:
It sounds like you're hearing something from the past that echo effect, to me, makes the ride, at least it builds the ride's tension so perfectly. Also the fact that this is the only ride that has sort of an exoskeleton, like, we can see parts of the ride feature when people drop down external of the structure. And yet still we are for some reason convinced that this is an old hotel. And I find that brilliant. Here's a quiz for.

Tim Foster [01:00:39]:

Daniel Roberts [01:00:40]:
All right. And for Tim.

Tim Foster [01:00:41]:
Thank you. True.

Daniel Roberts [01:00:42]:
False. That the chess game in the lobby of the tower of terror is a stalemate.

Tim Foster [01:00:50]:

Lou Mongello [01:00:52]:
So my understanding is that there's a mahjong game in the tower which had professional mahjong players come in and at one point they said, stop playing, and they made them get up and walk away. So it's not at a stalemate, but it is sort of at a midpoint because it would be. Everybody just disappeared.

Daniel Roberts [01:01:12]:
I met Marjon, and you passed the quiz twice because you did. All right, let me ask this.

Tim Foster [01:01:21]:
Well done, Lou.

Daniel Roberts [01:01:24]:
Oh, my know I had lunch with and you did.

Tim Foster [01:01:29]:
Can you tell me how that is?

Daniel Roberts [01:01:33]:
It's so good. But there was a waiter who knew his stuff about Disney World. We were in animal kingdom. I can't remember where. What we had.

Lou Mongello [01:01:42]:
Yakin Yeti.

Daniel Roberts [01:01:43]:
I remember Yakin Yeti. We had a bunch of sake and some mongolian beef or something. It was great. And the waiter didn't know who Lou was, but I said, there's no way you can stump this man. And I think he went back eleven or twelve times and it got to the point where before he would start speaking, they would say parrot outside of. He had the force. It was amazing. Do you remember that, Lou?

Lou Mongello [01:02:10]:
I do. And I was really nervous that I was going to get one wrong and lose all credibility, but oh, my God.

Daniel Roberts [01:02:17]:
You were on fire. It was amazing. And the guy. I went back later to go to the ladies room with my little daughter, and the guy was like, just shaking his head. He didn't want to say anything. He was still like, didn't know where this man, Mr. Mangello, came from. Anyway, back to the beautiful.

Daniel Roberts [01:02:38]:
It's. I think that the tower hotel, I think it's the second tallest building in all the world, next to expedition Everest, I think. And I know that they had many.

Tim Foster [01:02:53]:
Ideas, the Empire State buildings a little taller.

Lou Mongello [01:02:56]:
I think he means the Disney world, Tim.

Tim Foster [01:02:58]:
Oh, yeah.

Daniel Roberts [01:03:00]:
I said expedition Everest.

Tim Foster [01:03:02]:
I'm a jerk. I'm sorry. I know what you meant.

Daniel Roberts [01:03:06]:
But I had read that they were considering making, and Lou could correct me on this, and if. Nice waiter from Yak. And Yeti is listening. Well, you can't correct me on this because Lou beat you. Moving on that, they were considering basing the Tower of terror ride or whatever that ride was going to be on a Stephen King novel. Lou.

Lou Mongello [01:03:33]:
Okay, so I actually talk about this on a wayback machine or a DSI, and I will, only without giving too much away. At one point they did look to base it on a Stephen King novel, but only after they ended up abandoning him. The idea of basing it on a Mel Brooks this was actually going to be based on. Again, I don't want to give too much away because I want you to go back and listen to the show, a link to it in the show notes. But the story was actually going to be one that was going to be crafted by Mel Brooks before that idea was fortunately or unfortunately abandoned. They did go over to talk to Stephen King, and that actually went pretty far forward as well before they decided to go with their own independent idea and basing it on the Tower Twilight zone.

Daniel Roberts [01:04:31]:
Do you know what novel it was of Stephen King's?

Tim Foster [01:04:34]:
Apparently we have to do homework to find.

Daniel Roberts [01:04:40]:
Anyway, I'm going to end my.

Tim Foster [01:04:43]:
I want to know now. I'm not doing the homework. I want to cheat. Tell me, what is it?

Daniel Roberts [01:04:48]:
I love the Tower hotel. I think. I almost wish that there was like a tour of the lobby, and I would love a tour of the grounds. I think it's just, you see enough. But there's a term in literature called a metonomy where you see a little bit and then you can imagine a lot and every little thing you see leading up to the tower hotel and every little thing you see in the tower hotel lobby. My imagination goes wild and I can just imagine what it would be like to stay there, despite the apparently many risks of staying there.

Lou Mongello [01:05:29]:
So, Tim, I'm going to quickly answer your question. Sorry. It was not a single Stephen King book. It was going to be an amalgam. Sorry. Of a number of his stories. There was also the Mel Brooks idea. It was also supposed to be a real working hotel that would have had that.

Lou Mongello [01:05:49]:
The story would have actually begun as you landed at Orlando International Airport and were brought over in a car that had the windows blacked out so the story would begin there. They also thought about doing like a ghost tour with Vincent Price being at the host or narrator again before all those ideas were abandoned. But I will just say quickly that this almost made my list, due in part to the inspiration from the mission in Riverside and the Chateau Marmont in Hollywood, and there is actually a Hollywood tower hotel in California, but not a lot of design came from that. But I love present tense. If you look carefully as you go through the exterior queue and you enter the building, and actually more so if you go to the exit, which is basically the hotel's entrance, and look really carefully at the archway ornamentation and the gardens and the twisted columns and the minarettes. They're beautiful. And they really do give you that sense that you have traveled back in time, which is really part of the reason why I love the theming and the story here more so than I did the California version, pre guardians of the Galaxy. Although I will say, just as a quick aside, the Tokyo Disney sea Tower of terror, which is identical mechanically to the California adventure one, is a complete redesign of the story because Twilight zone just doesn't exist there.

Lou Mongello [01:07:37]:
But the architectural design out there would make. If we were doing an all park list, the Tokyo Tarot terra would be very, if not highest, definitely top three architecture.

Daniel Roberts [01:07:50]:
I'm sorry to interrupt you. I have to interrupt because I'm turning 50 in a couple of years. I am going to Tokyo Sea. I was there before once for too brief, like 8 hours with my best friend. We went to Tokyo Sea. The Tower of terror there with the backstory of the explorer and the little doll nefriti, I forget the name, was one of the most extraordinary rides I've been on in my life.

Lou Mongello [01:08:18]:
And just so you know, Daniel, in case you didn't listen to last week's episode, we are doing a WW radio adventures by Disney to Japan next year with an add on in Tokyo. So we can talk offline if you'd like. Know if you'd like to come. Just saying. Yes, sir.

Tim Foster [01:08:36]:
Evidently I'm not invited.

Daniel Roberts [01:08:40]:
Tim, you and I are going.

Lou Mongello [01:08:44]:
Believe you are. I believe you are next.

Tim Foster [01:08:47]:
No, you know what? I'm out because you're just not inviting me anywhere. I feel we're zeroing down onto our top. These are really like top 15, right? When we do three people again, ten.

Lou Mongello [01:09:03]:
Is more of guidelines.

Tim Foster [01:09:04]:
It's more of a suggestion. So where should I go? I got two. These are, like, wildly specific because I'm winding down, because I always try and get the heroes out of the way so you don't steal them from. Go. You said something in your last soliloquy there, Lou, about me not being valid. I have to rewind the tape and listen to what you said because it was very hurtful. But.

Lou Mongello [01:09:32]:
That's hurtful. But go ahead.

Tim Foster [01:09:36]:
Yeah, but you did. And it's. So while we're in Epcot, Lou, spaceship Earth. When I was trying to figure out which ones to pick and what to mean, you could pick every structure in Walt Disney world, including the resort, certainly in Epcot. I thought about wanting to do something there and I didn't know where to begin. We talked about spaceship Earth and, Lou, you brought a whole new perspective to that that we hadn't even talked about or considered before, which is great. But every future world building has its own architectural story and you could talk about it. Every pavilion in world showcase has its own story versus both.

Tim Foster [01:10:26]:
Mostly historical artifacts and whatnot and everything else. We couldn't possibly talk about all of them. I'm kind of surprised. I've only talked about one so far. But I'm going to narrow, very specifically, one world showcase building, and I'm going to lead into it by, I don't know, what's the term we use for loop? Oh, that's right. Cheating. I'm going to cheat on this one and talk about an architectural imaginary trick that we kind of referred to a little. The whole notion of forced perspective, which we talked about.

Tim Foster [01:11:08]:
I'm sure everybody listening to this show knows exactly what forced perspective is. We talked about it several times. I know, Lou, you've talked about it numerous times and we've written about it and everybody knows. But for the one or two of you that don't know horse perspective, very quickly, you talk about Main Street, USA. Big great example whereby architectural elements, that's why we tie it into this show, get smaller and smaller as you go higher and higher up. The buildings in much of Disney, especially on Main street, for example, to make them appear taller, because we know what a window should be like when it's 30ft above our head, when we see one that's small and our brain tricks us into thinking it's got to be a little higher because we know how big it is. So blah, blah, blah. So that trick of the eye is used quite a lot in Disney.

Tim Foster [01:12:01]:
Not just on Main street, but even in things like the Rocky Mountains in Canada, where the trees get smaller and smaller as you get higher and higher up the mound to make the rocky mounds appear higher than they are. But these are all tricks to make structures appear taller than they are. But in world showcase, there's a kind of unique situation where there is a building where they had to do the reverse and make a building appear smaller than it actually is. And that's the American Adventure building, which I'm going to just focus on that one, even though we could weave wonderful tales of all of the other ten pavilions and the structures that are found within. And maybe you guys would be kind enough to even include one in your list. I don't know what's on your list, and you may be ready to talk about one, but there's so many things about the american adventure building, which is very cool and odly enough to us that live in America. It's the most. I don't want to say normal looking building, but most familiar looking building, let's put it that way, to us.

Tim Foster [01:13:07]:
So it's kind of an OD one to pick out in terms of unique architecture and so forth, because these are things we're used to. Me being in Philadelphia, I'm used to seeing these historical independence hall style buildings all the time. But there are a few things about the american venture that I'm going to bring up, and again, these are very specific, so I'm digging in deep. One is the bit about force perspective being used in reverse at the american adventure building. Because inside, I believe it's a five story building. But back in the day, when this building was common, they didn't build buildings more than two or three stories tall. So if they actually made a five story building, it wouldn't have been accurate historically. So they needed to somehow make it appear like a three story building, which, if you look at it from the exterior, it looks like a three story building.

Tim Foster [01:14:04]:
And they did so by using force perspective, but kind of backwards. So, in other words, instead of making the upper story windows look smaller, to make them appear farther away, they would do the reverse. So those windows might be larger than they may be, but proportionally, it all fits. So it looks to be a three story exterior from the outside, keeping with the time frame that the building was supposed to be built, which I thought is kind of neat. The other thing I find fascinating with that building, this is more of an artistic thing. Sorry, not an architectural thing, but is the use of color in the american adventure building. And I can hear you all. I can hear Lou.

Tim Foster [01:14:45]:
I can hear Lou moaning. I can hear Daniel groaning right now.

Daniel Roberts [01:14:48]:
No, I'm listening.

Tim Foster [01:14:49]:
Like, what color are you talking? There's red clay bricks and there's white. That's all there is.

Daniel Roberts [01:14:56]:
Tim, you made us think about going into the architectural stuff, but I love.

Tim Foster [01:15:01]:
Well, follow me on this ride. So there is an interesting use of color on the american adventure building, which I'm going to throw into the architectural bucket so we can talk about it in here. And it's actually the use of white in the trim on the american adventure building. And as you look at it from the outside, not only does it appear to be three stories, but it appears to be uniformly painted in a nice, ordinary shade of white. All the trim and all the windows and so forth. But that's not actually the case, because depending on how the sun hits it, depending on the angles and so forth, depending on what it's up against, as far as other materials and bricks and stuff, any color, white in particular, can take on a different shade. So knowing that, you probably couldn't even tell if you looked at it, but if you looked at the different levels and the different trim on the top versus on the first floor and the second story and so forth, the shades of white are subtly different so that they blend in with the sunlight, the ambient lighting, the brickwork next to it, and so forth, such that when you see all three of them, they look to be the same. If they were painted the same and you saw them, they would actually, oddly enough, look differently.

Tim Foster [01:16:20]:
One might look darker than the other and so forth. That's more of an artistic color theory thing. But I always was kind of fascinated when I read about that, because I think we've talked about color before as a top ten. Did we? Because we should. But white being a color, that's not a color. But in this case, it is. To me, it's not only because it's just neat that there's three different shades or four or five, however many. There are different shades of white, but there's that much attention that's paid to the details in everything you see at Disney.

Tim Foster [01:17:00]:
In this case, we're talking about architecture. And, Daniel, you talked about the architect, the historical artifact, nature of architecture, and what great lengths they go to make everything authentic, the time period, even the length of going across the globe to find artifacts that fit and not make this up in some prop shop. These are real things. I'm talking down to the color of white, really, but that's how detailed that they will get, to make sure what you see looks authentic and real and what it should look like, what it looked like back in the period, and blends in seamlessly and looks like there was no thought put into it when in reality, the thought put into that would dazzle, dare I say, boggle them up. And again, I know you could say you could go to every Pavilion world showcase and have a similar story about every structure in there and throw in the historical significance of each one. But I know we've done three hour shows before. And, Lou, you did your 24 hours thing, but I don't think we really want to do 24 hours on World showcase, which we could if we wanted.

Lou Mongello [01:18:15]:
Well, you actually, you know what? You may have said it half jokingly, but I think we could do a show, a top tennis show about the use of color and tips and tricks and techniques.

Tim Foster [01:18:28]:
I would love to. I feel like we did, but if we didn't, can I vote? That'd be our next top ten.

Lou Mongello [01:18:35]:
We'll see. I'll talk to Daniel and see if you actually make it to the next top ten or not based on your performance. I kid because I love Timmy Foster. You know that. But no, look, I would love to have that.

Tim Foster [01:18:46]:
Kicking him out or me out? Which one are you kicking out?

Lou Mongello [01:18:48]:
I'm kicking him out, but I'm just. Don't worry about it. Certainly you come to it, too, from an artist's perspective, even though deep down we know you're an architect, you really are an artist. So we can talk about art vandalism. Right? Because there's a lot of very, and I'm not going to spoil it, a lot of very deliberate, well thought out decisions that are made in terms of the use of color. We've talked about some of these in, on Main street and here in american adventure. I think I might have even mentioned sort of the color palette that's used to convey a sense of place for main Street USA versus the Disneyland version. That being said, in the interest of relative brevity for the show, I don't know how many more you guys have on your list.

Lou Mongello [01:19:42]:
I have a few and some honorable mentions, but what I'm going to do is I'm going to include one more, and then at the end, I'll wrap up just with a couple of things that I think bear, I just have one more.

Tim Foster [01:19:55]:
If I don't know where we are.

Daniel Roberts [01:19:56]:
I have, like, two 1 minute shout outs.

Tim Foster [01:19:59]:
All right, I'll have one more and then I'll make up r1 quick.

Lou Mongello [01:20:02]:
All right, so I'll go very quickly with this one. If you know me, this should not come as a surprise, because I think I find a way to incorporate this into almost every show. And now, based on what I just announced last week, in terms of our next sort of big group trip in 2019, you know my love of Japan, the country, the pavilion, the people, the cuisine, the history, the tradition, everything. And we did on show 32, which literally is like twelve years ago, we did a very detailed DSI Disney scene investigation of Japan. But in terms of architecture, in terms of the buildings, in terms of thematic design, without a doubt, I had to include Japan in here because while it's multiple buildings, some are connected, but it really is sort of divided into three distinct areas. There's sort of the east with the pagoda, that five story gojunoto pagoda, which is inspired by a real shrine in Nara. There are like everything in Japan. Everything has significance, everything has stories.

Lou Mongello [01:21:23]:
So the five tiers represent the five elements from which buddhists believe all things in the universe are produced. At the top of the pagodo is this beautiful soren, which is a spire with wind chimes and a water flame. And the building opposite is based on the Shinsen din, sort of the ceremonial hall at the imperial palace in Kyoto, where we're going on the abd, by the way. But I love also the building. First of all, Katsura Grill, which is inspired by that, which is one of my favorite places anywhere in Walter's world, you know, is one of my favorite. But if you look at the back of the pavilion, that fortress is massive. It is monstrously. It's big, not just in height, but in width.

Lou Mongello [01:22:08]:
And you don't necessarily realize in depth because of what was supposed to be there. But this was modeled after one in Himechi city called Shira. I had to write this down. Shirasagi. It's modeled after real fortress in Japan.

Tim Foster [01:22:26]:
Come on.

Lou Mongello [01:22:27]:
I can't. Shira. Sage or white? It's basically the white egret or the white heron castle. But those curved stone walls and those white plaster structures and that beautiful, vibrant blue tile roof is actually a design and a style that dates back to the mid 13 hundreds. And if you go back to the episode, you'll hear about the significance of the castle in feudal times and how these sort of dominated the japanese countryside and why they were built and the inhabitants of the castle towns and why it was built the way it was. It really is fascinating from a true historical perspective, but it's also fascinating from a Walt Disney world perspective, because as big as it is, like everything on the promenade, it doesn't necessarily dominate the view from any one point, going to your point about why the american adventure was built the way it was. But there's also a massive show building behind the castle, behind the Mitsukoshi department store that is not used because that was supposed to house an attraction like carousel of progress called Meet the World, which had songs by the Sherman brothers and whatnot, which, unfortunately, was never built. At one point, there was going to be a Mount Fuji roller coaster here.

Lou Mongello [01:23:58]:
We sort of get into it all back then. But this is one of my favorite pavilions for so many reasons, not the very least of which is the beautiful architecture, how well and how detailed it was recreated here, like everything else that we see in world showcase. But it maybe made my list for not just objective reasons, but subjective ones as well.

Tim Foster [01:24:25]:
I think we need DSi is notwithstanding, and whatever you've done before, but we need to do a top ten things we love about Japan. We didn't do that, did we?

Lou Mongello [01:24:35]:
I don't think so. But, dude, I'm down because we both.

Tim Foster [01:24:39]:
And Daniel, I know you're on board with this, but we've talked so many times. That's our favorite spot. Both of us, for whatever reason on there.

Daniel Roberts [01:24:50]:
That would be great. As a fan of the show, I would love to see.

Lou Mongello [01:24:54]:
I think better yet, I think we need to do it in Japan. Like at the Japan pavilion. At the pavilion.

Tim Foster [01:25:00]:
October 2. All right, Lou, I know you're not going to be there, but I'm just.

Lou Mongello [01:25:08]:
So just do the show without.

Tim Foster [01:25:13]:
Will. I will. Daniel, I'm sorry I stepped on your toes.

Lou Mongello [01:25:17]:
Daniel, please, go ahead.

Tim Foster [01:25:19]:
Anyway, I'm sorry.

Daniel Roberts [01:25:21]:
No, you're great tonight. You did a lot of research and I can tell.

Tim Foster [01:25:25]:
Yeah, I got two books open on the floor. That's a lot.

Daniel Roberts [01:25:28]:
No, I was spellbound by your discourse about the color white. That was amazing. Really?

Tim Foster [01:25:38]:
Well, I know it's not worth it.

Daniel Roberts [01:25:42]:
No, but I maybe want to go see it with my own eyes again and check it.

Tim Foster [01:25:49]:
Climb up to the third, bring a sheet of paper with you, compare it to the.

Daniel Roberts [01:25:53]:
Can I see that?

Tim Foster [01:25:54]:
And then climb up to the third floor and then just hold it up like a chirp. People do it all the time. They don't mind.

Daniel Roberts [01:26:00]:
Can I climb up to me?

Tim Foster [01:26:02]:
Sure, yeah. No, you don't need that. You just scale on them.

Daniel Roberts [01:26:06]:
All right. Thank you. My two throwouts are memento mori in frontier land because it is the only structure that has a backstory involving a ghost that you can actually step into. Because memento Mori is apparently the home of Madame Leota and sells the. I know, and I love her, too. I know you guys. Well, doesn't Lou have a crush on little Leota?

Tim Foster [01:26:43]:

Lou Mongello [01:26:44]:
Yeah, just move on.

Daniel Roberts [01:26:47]:
Nothing to see here. Got it. But it is a victorian structure. It looks like it could be same period as haunted mansion, Hudson Valley, 19 hundreds.

Tim Foster [01:27:03]:
You're going to do that, though.

Daniel Roberts [01:27:05]:
I know I told you, but I love the fact that you can tell your little kid that this is where. Or your wife or yourself that this is where Madame Leota lived. And she hasn't been here in a while, but she might be coming back. And in my opinion, that for haunted mansion aficionados and purists, well, they have all haunted mansion stuff. You can get a tie that looks like the wallpaper from the haunted mansion. You can get so many cool haunted mansion things, including you can get the platewear from the banquet scene. And it's an eerie place, and maybe she's still there. That's my first shout out.

Daniel Roberts [01:27:55]:
I love it because it's victorian. It matches the period just before the haunted mansion was created. So there's actually, like, a historical line of reference that she could have lived there before she somehow found her way next door to the haunted mansion. The second one is, this is a weird one, but I love the twining's tea house world showcase, England in great Britain, because the roof is tilted and weird, but it looks like the real deal. There's something about the angle of the roof at the twining's tea house that makes me want to go in there and sort of be one with it. And those are my last two shout outs.

Lou Mongello [01:28:40]:
I love the tcatty building. And if you go back and listen to, I don't know, the episode, I did a walkthrough of Epcot of the United Kingdom in Epcot with somebody from the United Kingdom talking about the authenticity of the buildings and the inspiration where they come from. And all those buildings in that cluster represent different time periods. Again, I don't want to sort of spoil it for you, but I don't remember what number it was, but we do a walkthrough and talk very specifically about that building, not just the exterior, but the interior as well, and some of the neat details that are in there. So I'm happy that you added that to your list.

Daniel Roberts [01:29:21]:
Thank you.

Tim Foster [01:29:21]:
Well done, Daniel.

Lou Mongello [01:29:24]:
Timmy Foster.

Tim Foster [01:29:30]:
This is funny, because when I'm done with mine, I know, Lou, you're going to ratle off two, three at the most, I'm sure. And I don't know if you're pulling a saving the best for last or if you, like me, throw out all the good ideas lest someone steal them. Daniel. No, I didn't mean to say that out loud, Lou. I can hear the Internet screaming right now in protest and desperation, like we're talking about Disney architecture. The only castle that's come up in the whole conversation is the one in Japan. What are we doing, guys?

Lou Mongello [01:30:23]:
I think I said at the outlet that I very deliberately kept the castle off the. I felt the castle was too obvious. And we've talked about it ad nauseam in terms of origin, illusion, story, et.

Daniel Roberts [01:30:40]:
Was off limits. Or.

Tim Foster [01:30:44]:
Here'S the thing again. Lou makes a rule at the beginning of the show.

Lou Mongello [01:30:49]:
No, it was just for myself. I just left it off. No, I left it off. Just personally, it was just my own choice.

Tim Foster [01:30:55]:
No, I'm not going to Cinderella Castle, by the way, just so Lou, you can go. Actually, for the same reason. I have castle notes, but I was kind of laying off them for kind of the same reason. One I was sure when he was going to talk about them. But also, yes, we've talked about the castle. You've talked about the castle so many times. How much more can we say? But I'm going to throw a little shout out to a lesser castle that exists in the magic kingdom. And it doesn't belong to Cinderella, but it belongs to Rapunzel.

Tim Foster [01:31:39]:
And I'm throwing this one in there because this is interesting on a lot of levels. Just seeing it, it's beautiful during the day, during the night, that whole area of fantasy land is totally transformed from what it was, which was basically a stroller parking lot. And now it's a, I want to say destination. I mean, you can't go in the tower, obviously, but it's a place to go. It's actually a place of significance now. It's not just an oh, by the place of respite.

Lou Mongello [01:32:18]:
It's a place to rest.

Tim Foster [01:32:20]:
It's a place to charge your phones. It's a place to relax and listen to the waterfall as it meanders down the mountainside, cascading past the glorious structure that is beautiful. But what the neat thing about it, from an architectural standpoint is, I'm sure there's many, many other examples of this we could find. Nay, it could be a story show unto itself. But this was an architectural structure born out of necessity just as much as it was born out of the need for theming and entertainment and that sort of thing. Sure, everybody knows this story, but back when they expanded the Peter Pan interactive queue to what it is now, it necessitated removing everyone's favorite restrooms in all of the magic kingdom, the ones over at Peter Pan. And they needed to put new ones in somewhere. And what better place than that kind of empty area over there where they park strollers right now? But this is Disney.

Tim Foster [01:33:35]:
Do we just build restrooms and call it a day? Where are you, universal? This is Disney. When we build stuff we build. So the idea of having to build restrooms across the way in another part, let's just not. Let's make this a whole. So this became an area themed around Rapunzel's tower, besides the tower itself, which is a deceptively magnificent structure, because obviously, compared to Cinderella's castle, even compared to Prince Eric's castle, or even the beast castle, even though it's so far away, this is kind of an innocuous tower just sitting there. But if you go and look at it, it really is beautiful. And it's just the centerpiece of a whole mini land within fantasy land, home to Maximus's footprints, the ground, the half eaten apples, pascal the lizard. I really hope I'm getting these names right, because I haven't seen tangled in quite a long time, and quite possibly one of the best restrooms in all of fantasy in all of the magic kingdom, oh, by the way, since you had to make them.

Tim Foster [01:34:57]:
But at night, it comes alive with the lanterns hanging across the entire courtyard, just strings of lanterns lighting everywhere, the towers lit up. We actually did a cover story on Rapunzel's tower way back when, and I was kind of researching, I was trying to find out how tall it was, and wouldn't you know, that's actually a pretty difficult piece of information to find, or at least it was at the time. But what I did find out was that the tower in the original story, way back, was 20 l's tall. Now, you can collectively ask me, little Timmy Foster, what is an l? Go ahead, somebody say, well, I'll tell you what it is. It's a unit of measurement. I'm reading this out of my article that vary wildly throughout Europe. Now, what I can tell you is it was approximately 44 inches. Well, what does that make? That makes the tower in the original story about 73ft tall, the tower in the film, about 70ft tall.

Tim Foster [01:36:07]:
And as best as you can guess, with some trigonometry and some shadows and some careful measurement, that's how tall the tower is in Fantasyland. It's one of those things that there's no attraction or anything there. So most people probably pass by, look at, and go, that's pretty cool. But other than to look at, admire, there's no real reason to stop there. But just like so many other things at Disney, there's such a story behind it, from why it was built in the first place to its connection to the movie and the story that inspired the movie far beyond what you might think if you just wandered past and looked at it. There's so much. If you peel back those layers of the onion loo, there's so much to find in that area. And beyond the tower, which itself, I'll say it's strikingly beautiful, especially at night.

Tim Foster [01:37:03]:
I will just stand and watch it just because it's kind of perky.

Lou Mongello [01:37:09]:
I have mixed emotions about the tower. I think it's beautiful. Although I do miss my skyway chalet that stood in that spot.

Tim Foster [01:37:20]:
Lane Rapunzel for the sky.

Lou Mongello [01:37:24]:
And listen, I have contemplated for years doing a top ten restrooms in Walt Disney World.

Tim Foster [01:37:30]:
I know you have. And that's one of guys.

Daniel Roberts [01:37:34]:
I don't want to do that one.

Tim Foster [01:37:37]:
No, you know what? Spoiler. I shouldn't say that.

Lou Mongello [01:37:42]:
I know it. Don't spoil, because we might actually do it.

Tim Foster [01:37:46]:
All right? And there's research I'm not willing to do that might be pushing the barrier.

Lou Mongello [01:37:56]:
We'll let the pupil decide if that's what they want to hear people speak.

Tim Foster [01:38:00]:
If you want to let us know in the show notes below, or call the. I'm doing your.

Lou Mongello [01:38:07]:
You don't even know how it works. You don't even know how it works.

Tim Foster [01:38:09]:
No, I don't. I've never watched. Listen to this.

Lou Mongello [01:38:11]:
All right, I'm going to wrap up my list.

Tim Foster [01:38:16]:

Lou Mongello [01:38:17]:
Just sit back, relax, just for a minute. I will tell you that something that I did have on my list that I left off and didn't get to and had contemplated back and forth, was the tree of life. And you might say to yourself, well, that's technically not really a building, but it kind of is, because there is a show building at the base of it. And that's really one of the reasons why I had planned on including it was because of not just the engineering, but the innovation in terms of using an oil rig as sort of a model in order to build that. And then everything that it took to solve all of the engineering difficulties, the fact that it was, to a certain degree, that final design, to a certain degree, was based on a bonsai tree that imagineers found at one of the very early flower and garden festivals over in Epcot. But having all of those primary and secondary and tertiary and all the different end branches, it very much is a marvel. And Dyk, did you know that before they had the idea to put a show in the base, there was actually supposed to be a restaurant down there called roots restaurant? No, true. I would not lie to you, really.

Lou Mongello [01:39:36]:
At least not about that. Others that I think could.

Daniel Roberts [01:39:40]:
Very sorry, Lou. I'm sorry. It was going to be beneath the ground.

Lou Mongello [01:39:44]:
No, it was going to be sort of in the base. So right now, where the theater is, was going to be a restaurant. So in sort of the roots of the tree, but not underground because Florida others, that very high water table, no basements. A couple that I think bear mentioning would be the swiss family treehouse, which I consider a building a structure. I think it's just incredibly unique. Certainly the contemporary in terms of the methodology that was used. Very unique methodology in terms of that sort know building. It sort of like a chest of drawers type of thing.

Lou Mongello [01:40:27]:
I almost had harambe, that little village of Harambe. In terms of respect for the architecture and the story and how they created this fictional place. I think Space Mountain, again, from an engineering perspective, having those structural beams on the outside of the building was a very innovative thing to do. Again, especially thinking this is going back to the early 70s. It's something that happens much more common now. But it solved the problem of having the smooth ceiling inside for projections. And also made for a very unique design element as well. So I think Space Mountain for what it was in terms of not just the ride system itself, but the building.

Lou Mongello [01:41:23]:
Did you know that to build Space Mountain cost more than it did to build all of Disneyland? Space Mountain cost about 18, 19 million. And Disneyland cost 17 million to build total. Finally, because I have to just throw a couple of last ones in here, I think. Universe of energy, again, for the technical innovations this originally was supposed to have. There was supposed to be a solar energy pavilion. And they were going to sort of have this parabolic solar collector, which would have been more decorative than functional. But as the plans evolve and it becomes universe of energy, and they want to sort of bring, again forward thinking real world technology in there. The solar power Corporation, which was actually a subsidiary of Exxon, built what at the time was the largest private solar installation in the world.

Lou Mongello [01:42:24]:
And there's 2156 panels that for a long time powered that attraction. During the. I guess it was late 80s, early 90s. You might not know this. The solar panel system actually stopped working because the operating costs were so very high. And it took about a year or two. I think maybe when they did the refurb in 96, that they brought the array back up again and they replaced all the panels and all the wiring. But this idea of sort of riding on sunshine, I think, necessitates this to almost be mentioned.

Lou Mongello [01:43:08]:
And just from a personal preference, I just love the design of the haunted mansion because I just think it's so.

Tim Foster [01:43:15]:
It's creepy.

Lou Mongello [01:43:17]:
It's just cool and creepy and I dig it, but I want to. No, no, please.

Tim Foster [01:43:24]:
I wanted to put a punctuation on this.

Lou Mongello [01:43:27]:

Tim Foster [01:43:27]:
Before you did your welcoming. And Daniel should have a parting shot as well.

Lou Mongello [01:43:32]:
Oh, no, we're all going to have. Yes, I certainly will give you all parting.

Tim Foster [01:43:35]:
I. I know, know you're about to launch into the most important part of the show.

Lou Mongello [01:43:40]:
So predictable.

Tim Foster [01:43:41]:
No, I mean, seriously, the viewers and getting involved or the viewers? The listeners. Viewers.

Daniel Roberts [01:43:50]:
Is there a camera?

Tim Foster [01:43:51]:
We're on video right now. Did you know?

Daniel Roberts [01:43:53]:
Oh, no. I think addressed.

Tim Foster [01:43:56]:
No, I just wanted to add. Not to point out like two or three or four extra ones, but just the idea as we talked about it. And it hit home again to me as we were doing this, but we talk about this so often, but the architecture of everything. I don't think there is any building in the entirety of Walt Disney world. Whether you're talking about the parks, the attractions, resorts, the shops, Disney Springs, anything, that there is no structure that doesn't have an architectural significant story to it, whether it's a functional thing or more often than not, a theming aspect to it. Whether it's building a new structure like a contemporary, meant to evoke a time period, but nothing specific. Or if it's a reference to something very specific, like Daniel mentioned with expedition Everest, you could say that with Cali river rapids and many other attractions that so heavily rely on historical and architectural accuracy to bring these places to life. And I just want to say we could do every single building in Walt Disney World and have the same discussion about each one of them.

Tim Foster [01:45:25]:
And I think that's one of the most. That's a wonderful thing. When this topic came up and we talked about was, on one hand, it was easy to find things to talk about because there's so many examples. But on the other hand, it was hard to. What five do I want to talk about? Because there are so many, and we left so many out. And Lou and I knew you're going to ask your wonderful audience to add in their thoughts, but it was kind of hard to nail down five to talk about while leaving so many others out that are so worthy.

Lou Mongello [01:45:57]:
I absolutely agree. You could make an argument for almost every building as to why it should be on the list.

Tim Foster [01:46:06]:
Daniel, what do you have to say?

Daniel Roberts [01:46:09]:
Well, gosh, what a great show. The problem is that any show that I'm on, then I don't listen to it, that I'm going to miss the show for a week because I don't like the sound of my own voice.

Lou Mongello [01:46:21]:
Nobody listens. I mean, nobody likes the sound. What I meant is nobody likes the sound of their own voice. I'm sorry, is what I was trying to.

Tim Foster [01:46:29]:
Nobody likes.

Daniel Roberts [01:46:31]:
No, because that is my biggest compliment to this show and to Lou and to Tim, is that it will bug me that there'll be a new show and I will not listen to it only because of voice vanity. That said, I would say that I thought this was an amazing show about these buildings, and there are so many left out, especially in world showcase. I don't think we did terrific justice to the Hollywood studios.

Tim Foster [01:47:13]:
Disney's Hollywood just called MGM, my family.

Daniel Roberts [01:47:18]:
And also things like the grand Floridian, the hotels. I definitely had contemporary. I had so many of the hotels on my list, but it's hard to whittle it down. But I just want to thank Lou for masterminding this podcast and all he does, and to remind people that this is the definitive podcast or source of information about the most popular resort in the history of the world. And now for my daughter, Miranda, I'm going to do a very brief ghost host. Are you ready?

Lou Mongello [01:48:08]:
I don't know.

Tim Foster [01:48:09]:
Oh, we're doing impressions. I'm loving this.

Daniel Roberts [01:48:13]:
All right. No windows and no doors.

Lou Mongello [01:48:21]:
That's it.

Daniel Roberts [01:48:23]:
That's all I got.

Tim Foster [01:48:25]:
No, I lost complete control.

Lou Mongello [01:48:28]:
Go ahead, Tim.

Tim Foster [01:48:29]:
What? Go ahead. Live in the. No way. I don't know exact words.

Lou Mongello [01:48:37]:
You're going to do an impression of somebody and you don't know what this person says?

Tim Foster [01:48:42]:
No, you do it all the time, my daughter. As long as we're all talking about our wonderful daughters, she always chides me when I quote something and I miss a word and I get it wrong, so I don't do bits around her anymore. She always corrects me.

Lou Mongello [01:49:01]:
But was that supposed to be. Wait, just before you say, was that supposed to be your Edna mode?

Tim Foster [01:49:07]:
Yeah, but give me the words and I'll.

Lou Mongello [01:49:09]:
I never look back, darling. It distracts from the now. Is that what that was supposed to be?

Tim Foster [01:49:13]:
I never look back, darling. It only distracts from the now. That sounded like not Ed Mode.

Lou Mongello [01:49:23]:
Yeah. No.

Tim Foster [01:49:30]:
I just want to leave. If we say pressions and you talk Lou Mangelo, a lady, I had to throw it out. That was good at me. Now, for some reason, Lou, it's your fault. I didn't even say it.

Lou Mongello [01:49:43]:
You said, I get it. I'm happy that my bad Jerry Lewis stuck. Probably. I'm probably happy that it stuck more than my bad 20,000 leagues under the sea impression, but anyway, listen, the question.

Tim Foster [01:50:01]:
Better than shall tell you that the.

Lou Mongello [01:50:04]:
Question that I have for our friend, my friend you, if you're still listening, thank you. I want to know from you what building you think is the most important or impressive, symbolic, detailed or even just meaningful for you. What I'd love for you to do is a couple of different things you can to let me know. I'd love to keep this conversation going in our group over on Facebook. If you go to www.radio.com community that will take you to our box people group over on Facebook, would love the conversation to continue there. You can also tweet me at lou Mangello. Better yet, call the voicemail four oh 7909 three nine one. That's four oh 7900 wD, wdw one.

Lou Mongello [01:50:53]:
And tell us, let me hear it. Let me hear it in your voice. Which building you think should be on the list, which is important to you and why, unlike this podcast, you only have three minutes for a voicemail. So make it count. Daniel, I'm calling right now. Appreciate not just you being here tonight, but I appreciate you. And not just the friendship that you extend to me, but really you've done so much as so many people have for the make a wish foundation through our dream team project. So I am grateful to you and for you, Timmy Foster.

Lou Mongello [01:51:26]:
I love you, brother. It's been a long time we've been doing this and you never fail to show up. Disappointment. I'm going to tell people to go to celebrationspress.com, but I have a feeling you're going to tell them.

Tim Foster [01:51:41]:
Why. Can I tell them?

Lou Mongello [01:51:42]:
Of course.

Tim Foster [01:51:44]:
Daniel, what's the most definitive source of Disney information in print form?

Lou Mongello [01:51:50]:
You got a minute and a half, so go.

Daniel Roberts [01:51:52]:
That's Timmy Foster's celebrations magazine.

Tim Foster [01:51:56]:
Right you are, sir. And where can you find. All right, I sound like a real jerk now.

Daniel Roberts [01:52:01]:
No, you got to tell them where.

Tim Foster [01:52:04]:
I got to do it. No, please come. Please come visit us.

Lou Mongello [01:52:10]:
No, listen, Tim, listen. You have continued for so many years and so many issues to deliver that kind of content that you know that. So don't say it like the publisher, say it like somebody who just loves the magazine and why people should go and read it.

Tim Foster [01:52:33]:
This is the most beautiful magazine.

Lou Mongello [01:52:35]:
Oh my gosh, I'll forget it. Listen, we are Disney fans who are hungry for content. We love to get it in, obviously, audio form, video form. There's still nothing like holding a high quality printed publication that is made with love by people who love this place. And that's exactly what celebrations magazine is. And that is why you shouldn't just pick up a single issue, but you should subscribe@celebrationspress.com. Boom.

Tim Foster [01:53:04]:
That was beautiful.

Lou Mongello [01:53:05]:

Tim Foster [01:53:06]:
Do you know how many issues we've done? I kind of alluded this in our.

Lou Mongello [01:53:09]:
Last podcast, 50 some OD issues.

Tim Foster [01:53:13]:
59 is hitting mailboxes now. In fact, I hope most everybody has it by now. If you don't, you can contact our customer service department@celebrationpress.com. But issue number 60 is around the corner after that, Lou, our 10th anniversary issue is right around the corner, which I can't believe. And you said, I think you said twelve years ago or how long you been doing WWE?

Lou Mongello [01:53:42]:
It's 13 years.

Tim Foster [01:53:43]:
13 years. And we're coming on ten. And I still can't believe it. And I think I mentioned our last show, but we're getting excited. I got one more issue to get out, which will be fabulous, by the way. But then we're trying to think of special things we can do with our 10th anniversary issue. I would love ideas if anyone has them, but what I'm really thinking of doing, I didn't want to pat us on the back because it's. Lou, I appreciate your kind words and stuff.

Tim Foster [01:54:14]:
We do this for the love of Disney and Disney World. So what I really want to do is take that issue, take that opportunity. We're going to take a look at Disney right out of the gate. We're going to look at how it's changed. We've changed. We've all changed. Everybody's changed. Disney's changed in the ten years since we've started.

Tim Foster [01:54:32]:
And we thought it might be fun. Take a look back where it was when we started, where we are now, and all the wonderful stuff that's happened in between. So that's coming up. So that's really exciting. And I'm sure we're going to have a bunch of promotions and stuff to go along with it. And I don't know if I actually had it in my hand. Well, last time we did the podcast. But our newest book, speaking of top ten lists, 112 Disney lists, our newest book, our paperback book, our first one is here.

Tim Foster [01:55:01]:
It exists. It is now. So you can go to celebrationspress.com and order it. We're still going to maintain our presale order price that we had. We're going to keep that going for a while because we love all you guys. We want you to get this book for the price that it was always meant to be. But if you come on over, we have that available. The magazines there all kinds of fun stuff coming up.

Tim Foster [01:55:26]:
And beyond that, there's so much more. And I can't wait to come back and do this again. It's been too long since we've done this.

Lou Mongello [01:55:33]:
Well, you blew them in half about nine minutes ago. But that's okay because I still love and appreciate what you do. And I want as many people as possible to be able to enjoy what you do. Guys, thank you again so very much for this.

Daniel Roberts [01:55:49]:
Thank you, Lou.

Lou Mongello [01:55:49]:

Daniel Roberts [01:55:50]:
I love you guys.

Lou Mongello [01:55:52]:
I love and appreciate you guys. It's always interesting.

Daniel Roberts [01:55:59]:
Oh, man. Until next year. I love you guys.

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